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812 phaeton brakes - twightlight zone?

  • dougklink
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16 Jun 2006 22:56 #4979 by dougklink
Replied by dougklink on topic Brakes
I also discovered that a different part number wheel cylinder was required on the front as the brake hoses had a 7/16-20 thread and the rear brake lines had a 7/16-24 thread for the brake line fitting.

Doug Klink
Estes Park, Colorado

812 S/C Phaeton

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  • dougklink
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13 Jun 2006 22:29 #4959 by dougklink
Replied by dougklink on topic Brakes
You're correct Josh. I've dug into them deeper today. Clearly the car has miles on it since the contact points where the shoes touch the backing plates have been brazed to build them where they had worn. Who knows when they were bastardized.

In the Bendix system, are 1-1/16" straight bore wheel cylinders correct? And are the linings equal length?

Thanks

Doug Klink
Estes Park, Colorado

812 S/C Phaeton

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  • Josh Malks
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13 Jun 2006 18:30 #4958 by Josh Malks
Replied by Josh Malks on topic 812 phaeton brakes - twightlight zone?
References in Cord literature to "Lockheed" and "Bendix" brakes refer to the design, not necessarily the manufacturer. Wagner-Lockheed made cylinders for all designs of brakes.

Lockheed design brakes (on Cords) have a single large anchor at the bottom, with the shoes held to the anchor by a horseshoe clip. Bendix design brakes have an anchor at the top to which the shoes are held by springs, and a star wheel adjuster at the bottom.

Generally, on Cords, Lockheed design brakes use stepped cylinders, Bendix design straight cylinders.

And they are mixed up because some @#$!%^& in the dim history of your car didn't know what he was doing.

Josh B. Malks
810 2087A
ACD Club Life Member
ACD Newsletter editor
Past president
www.automaven.com

Check out CORD COMPLETE at www.cordcomplete.com

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  • Mike Brady
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13 Jun 2006 12:07 #4956 by Mike Brady
Replied by Mike Brady on topic 812 phaeton brakes - twightlight zone?
Doug:

You may find that the NAPA wheel cylinders have a brass seat in the threaded line inlet. The seats are not need in the front wheel cylinders. The seat can be removed easily from the front wheel cylinders and you will need to remove them to thread in the front brake hoses.

CORDially, Mike

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  • dougklink
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13 Jun 2006 03:55 #4955 by dougklink
812 phaeton brakes - twightlight zone? was created by dougklink
My car has been stopping fine when I have been driving it but I removed the wheels to mount hubcap rings and found a brake fluid leak at the LR wheel. I had been told the previous owner had done a brake job recently but apparently not.

So it seemed time to replace all the wheel cylinders. I did a search and read all the back posts on the ACD site before I took things apart and it appeared I'd be seeing stepped wheel cylinders.

Upon removal of the drums, I found that the wheel cylinders were Wagner Lockheed 2751 casting numbers, 1-1/16 straight bore on all four wheels. All the linings were marked "Wagner Lockheed" on the edges, and "primary" or "secondary" as well. Could be original?

Primaries are on the front shoe on the rear axle, but are mixed on the front axle. RF primary faces rear, LF primary faces forward. What's correct? Does it matter if they are the same length or was there a difference in the friction coefficient of the lining material?

The brake lines are still copper, too, so they haven't been replaced.

I have been told that the Wagner brakes didn't have star wheel adjustment, just the Bendix did, but mine do on the bottom.

The linings are equal length and area both primary and secondary, which is also counter to what I read in the old posts.

The good news is I can replace the 2751s for $23 each from NAPA (PN 37262 and 37263 so I'm going to do that until this gets sorted out and I restore the car.

What is correct? Any ideas on how my car might have wound up this way if it is not correct? Other thoughts?

Thanks

Doug Klink
Estes Park, Colorado

812 S/C Phaeton

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