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810 trunk interior

  • wynlaidig
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31 Oct 2019 21:23 #38753 by wynlaidig
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Right, but fresh new burlap has a yellow golden color, like newly harvested wheat. So the question is whether is was naturally yellowish golden or whether they actually used died burlap to begin with.

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  • Tim Gilmartin
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31 Oct 2019 21:23 #38752 by Tim Gilmartin
Replied by Tim Gilmartin on topic 810 trunk interior
Hi Wyn: Yes, that one side was nice; but take a look at the fill side. Pretty gnarly. The nice looking fine line material is not the same as the burlap. All the burlap material had the “natural” color jute backing it.
Tim.

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  • Terry Cockerell
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31 Oct 2019 21:19 #38751 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
Rick Hulett told me that all of the trunk lining material had the same yellowish golden background colour but it had faded with time.
I believe the striped material with the fine lines in Tim Gilmartin's picture is the outside of the fuel tank filler pipe sleeve.

T cockerell

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  • wynlaidig
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31 Oct 2019 17:54 #38749 by wynlaidig
Replied by wynlaidig on topic 810 trunk interior
Also, do we have any real evidence to know whether the background jute was natural color or whether it was died a yellow/gold as I see some people use? Every original jute I have seen seems to be natural colored to me, just with black lines on it.

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31 Oct 2019 02:34 #38743 by wynlaidig
Replied by wynlaidig on topic 810 trunk interior
I am not quite clear on the 2 lined burlap photos (with rulers) from Tim Gilmartin. Are BOTH supposed to be original, or is only the wider lined one original? The finer lined one looks too new and crisp to be original to me.

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  • johnmereness
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29 Oct 2019 05:26 #38723 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior
Thanks Tim ! I hope you do not mind, I moved your photos and text over to the trunk page started a few days ago. Interestingly, the strap looks to be made of a different material than an Auburn (I will have to look more close). I think the buckle on the tool strap may be partially bent. Sidenote: Tim's car was my first ride in 36/37 Cord.

JMM

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29 Oct 2019 05:19 #38721 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

Tim Gilmartin wrote: Picture of gas fill tube covering; note rust from wires that held it on the tube. Jack hold down straps with flat washers still stuck to the webbing.


JMM

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29 Oct 2019 05:18 #38720 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

Tim Gilmartin wrote: Picture of backing material for the burlap; note faint outline of the “x” cross member of the back seat. Burlap with finer lines. Non burlap lined material was on the trunk side of the gas fill tube cloth wrap. The gas fill tube side is a tan/olive drab color.
Tim.


JMM

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29 Oct 2019 05:16 #38719 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

Tim Gilmartin wrote: Here are some pics of my trunk material as found on my Westchester in 1992. I have no reason to believe that this is not original material.


JMM

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  • johnmereness
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27 Oct 2019 16:12 #38708 by johnmereness
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And, always curious about tool rolls and tool.

JMM

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27 Oct 2019 16:11 #38707 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior
Also, notice on Mark Clayton's car the bolt that holds the spare tire bracket has a "marked" head - on an Auburn the bolts are all Black Oxide or Parkerized finish, though on a Cord the marked bolts are plated.

JMM

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27 Oct 2019 16:06 - 27 Oct 2019 16:10 #38706 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior
As a sidenote, I would think the original installation had a certain number of nails - they probably did glue a portion, but obviously glues then was not of best longevity. The diagram on page 3 notes a certain number of nails. They probably also used a number of drive nails to hold the carpet to the floor - I see some "divots" in the carpet on Mark Clayton's car and assume them to be drive nails.

JMM
Last edit: 27 Oct 2019 16:10 by johnmereness.

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27 Oct 2019 15:49 - 27 Oct 2019 15:59 #38705 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior
Michael, Thank You !!! The photos explain perfectly and very much appreciated. I would not have guessed that is what I was looking at. I think we now have a pretty complete page for how to do a trunk, excepting your car is short one or two pieces of carpet or .... In the compliments department one fine automobile !

JMM
Last edit: 27 Oct 2019 15:59 by johnmereness.

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  • Michael R
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26 Oct 2019 18:43 #38695 by Michael R
Replied by Michael R on topic 810 trunk interior
some pics arround the corner. the cloth is fastened with some nails wich I do not really want to remove





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26 Oct 2019 15:51 - 26 Oct 2019 16:08 #38694 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior
Hello, hoping that you are not totally frustrated with me, though I am having trouble figuring out the panel that is in the lower center portion of this photo - it appears to go around the corner and I see it has some sewing on the edge (and a nail in it) and equally does not have the jute backing. I really hate to ask, though would it be possible to do another photo more toward the upper corner of what this piece does - I do not think I am seeing it on the sketch on page 3. I did go on a couple hour crusade yesterday to find the "C" shaped clip on the non-buckle end of the tool strap (using your photos). Amazing this all survived - I had a 1941 Cadillac 60 Special with 14K miles on it and the trunk was not this nice.

JMM
Last edit: 26 Oct 2019 16:08 by johnmereness.
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  • Michael R
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25 Oct 2019 20:19 #38692 by Michael R
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some pics arround the hinges







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24 Oct 2019 13:52 - 24 Oct 2019 13:52 #38683 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior
Awesome trunk pictures. And, awesome car - not many survive in this state - needle in a haystack !!! I know this is a lot to ask, though could you do two more photos to see a little more detail looking from the trunk floor up at the top corners of the trunk around the hinges R & L which I would assume to be mirrors of each other. Interesting how they have the screws visible on the straps - not as finished as if they had screws on inside, yet screws probably then would damage the tool bag). Thank you again for the help.

JMM
Last edit: 24 Oct 2019 13:52 by johnmereness.

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  • Terry Cockerell
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23 Oct 2019 20:27 #38675 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
Hi Michael, thanks for these wonderful pictures. It is astonishing that it had all survived. It sets a benchmark for restorations.
Kindest regards,
Terry Cockerell
Australia

T cockerell
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  • Michael R
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23 Oct 2019 19:24 #38674 by Michael R
Replied by Michael R on topic 810 trunk interior
trunk lid








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23 Oct 2019 19:21 #38673 by Michael R
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23 Oct 2019 19:18 #38672 by Michael R
Replied by Michael R on topic 810 trunk interior
just an old dirty trunk...






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22 Oct 2019 14:41 #38660 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior
Would it be possible to poke your camera into all the corners upper, lower. front, back, and etc., plus all four corners of trunk lid too - Your appear to be the fore-leader in how a proper trunk should be done - more or less you are the "history detective."?

JMM

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  • Michael R
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20 Oct 2019 19:19 #38639 by Michael R
Replied by Michael R on topic 810 trunk interior

Jonathan Richards wrote: Mr. Richards, 1937 Cord S#32410S , which you previously owned , is a Beverly sedan and NOT a Phaeton. Foolish old man. You should know better , and used to. The other Mr. Richards with clearer brain.


Dear Mr. Richards, it is the best sign of a good charakter if you can make a joke about your own mistakes! you are a great man!


to John Mereness, wich details do you want? I´ll do my very best to help

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20 Oct 2019 02:17 #38635 by Jonathan Richards
Replied by Jonathan Richards on topic 810 trunk interior
Mr. Richards, 1937 Cord S#32410S , which you previously owned , is a Beverly sedan and NOT a Phaeton. Foolish old man. You should know better , and used to. The other Mr. Richards with clearer brain.

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20 Oct 2019 01:36 - 20 Oct 2019 03:52 #38634 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
Hi Jack, I agree entirely with your comments. I have attached a picture which shows three material samples.
In the background is the original piece from behind the rear seat, it has thick black lines.
To the RHS is the sample supplied by Rick Hulett which has thin black lines with a finer pattern.
At the lower LHS is the material I made up. It is based on the original sample but I made the lines too thin. I was not looking at the bigger picture at the time. With care I can salvage the job by redrawing the lines thicker.
So we have two distinct line patterns, one with thick lines in early production cars and one with fine lines in later production cars.
I believe the background colour was all the same. The sample of the original material in the picture has faded a lot.
My Cord has Serial No 1586 A, I have no idea when the line pattern changed.

T cockerell
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Last edit: 20 Oct 2019 03:52 by Terry Cockerell. Reason: Adding picture. Spelling error

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  • Jonathan Richards
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19 Oct 2019 19:42 #38631 by Jonathan Richards
Replied by Jonathan Richards on topic 810 trunk interior
I very much dislike pouring cold water on an attempt to provide original trunk interior upholstery , HOWEVER , as I earlier posted on this thread the trunk interior views posted by Rum Runner on this post and #38485 are of 1937 Cord Supercharged Phaeton S # 32410S , of which I was a previous owner. It was restored by the late Col. Leonard Redburn of Missouri and it was he who installed the present excellent trunk upholstery. Sorry to be a spoiler , but we need to search for and find original upholstery examples in both Cord and Auburn marques to assure the accuracy of our restorations.

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19 Oct 2019 18:43 #38629 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

RumRunner wrote: All,

May, I talk you into more trunk photos too, including trunk floor and ...) ?

Thought I would capture and post pictures of the trunk fabric in my 812 Beverly. No idea if it is original but sure looks like it to me. Hope these can be of some help.

-Michael








JMM

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19 Oct 2019 18:39 - 19 Oct 2019 18:40 #38628 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

Michael R wrote: some pics of my unrestored 36 Westchester Nr. 704 Dimensions visible. The carpet has got a linnen protection arround and may have been nailed to the wooden platform





May I talk you into sticking your head into your trunk and doing some more detailed photos (including some overall, in corners, and ... ) ?

JMM
Last edit: 19 Oct 2019 18:40 by johnmereness.

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  • Terry Cockerell
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04 Oct 2019 09:22 - 04 Oct 2019 09:49 #38548 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
A kind thought Mike. Her name is spelt Zoey and she is quite a character heading for her tenth birthday after Christmas.
While Gai and I were in the Auburn Hospital in 2018 Zoey was in the Grand Parade with her friends the Butler family. She had a ball in the Butler's 1919 Auburn tourer.
I have already experimented with redrawing the lines and think it will work out ok.
The attached pictures show Zoey on the left with Taylor on the right
Cheers from Down Under,
Terry, Gai and Zoey

T cockerell
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Last edit: 04 Oct 2019 09:49 by Terry Cockerell. Reason: Adding picture and revising text

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  • mikespeed35
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04 Oct 2019 04:22 #38547 by mikespeed35
Replied by mikespeed35 on topic 810 trunk interior
Maybe Zoie can help you with the lines Terry. Sorry for probably spelling her name wrong.
CORDiallyMike

Mike Huffman

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04 Oct 2019 01:54 - 04 Oct 2019 01:55 #38544 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
Trunk Carpet Clips.
Having only one of the original clips in my trunk I was delighted to discover new clips and eyelets are available from Restoration Specialities in Winberg PA
They are called BURCO Clips.
Double Stud #8 X 3/4" ......................... Part No B112
Eyelet .......................................................... Part No B158
Washer ........................................................ Part No B33
Two sets are required.

T cockerell
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Last edit: 04 Oct 2019 01:55 by Terry Cockerell. Reason: Adding picture

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03 Oct 2019 22:15 #38541 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
Bill you are among friends and a lot closer to Auburn than I am. It is a step by step process but you will get there in the end. Rethinking my trunk lining dilemma regarding the true line spacing I think I can salvage the situation by redrawing the black lines and making them wider. I will do some more experimenting first but I think I will leave the job until the rest of the car is finished and on the road otherwise it will never get on the road. Just as well I made the panels removable.
Perhaps you can get Tim to copy and email you your judging sheet?

T cockerell

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03 Oct 2019 19:51 #38538 by wcoye
Replied by wcoye on topic 810 trunk interior
Amen. Had my car judge at the 2018 Reunion with the hopes of learning what I could/should do to improve my car. Of course, couldn't view judging sheets. Called Tim Gilmartin and bless his soul he read me my sheet , but I don't take shorthand or take notes particularly fast so a lots of things didn't get written down. Also, finding out what's "wrong" with your Cord doesn't necessarily tell what or how to "fix" the issue.
My 2 cents

Bill Coye
Westchester 2240A
Brag line: Winner of the
2014 Hillsborough Concurs Strother MacMinn award

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03 Oct 2019 19:23 #38533 by mikespeed35
Replied by mikespeed35 on topic 810 trunk interior
The problem is if you want to WIN you can't. That is the down side of judging.
CORDiallyMike

Mike Huffman

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  • STEVEN.KUIPER
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03 Oct 2019 13:24 #38529 by STEVEN.KUIPER
Replied by STEVEN.KUIPER on topic 810 trunk interior
great restoration guidelines in the 1960's and 1970's would state " part is painted black or engine is green" that was o.k. for then as technology was limited. today with all the digital cameras available virtually everywhere it would be possible to document original features on original cars. a picture says a 1000 words. as there are many many un-restored cars out there a photo authenticity guide could really improve future cord restorations. a good photo restoration guide could fuel stalled projects & inspire restoration to a higher standard. not quite knowing what is correct has caused some owners to never start. on a related line some cars(or areas on cars) do not need to be restored. just preserved. so there's a moth hole or 2 in the seat. if it is the original fabric, it should be saved.
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03 Oct 2019 09:44 - 03 Oct 2019 09:46 #38528 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
I dug out the best sample I had of the original trunk lining material which actually came from behind the rear seat and photographed it with the fine line sample which came from Rick Hulett and an off cut of my reproduction material. I was obviously too close to what I was doing as I should have used a wider tipped pen.
When I suggested to my wife that I could remove the lining panels and redo the lines to widen them ................. she replied "DON"T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT!"
I guess it stays.

T cockerell
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Last edit: 03 Oct 2019 09:46 by Terry Cockerell. Reason: Adding picture

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01 Oct 2019 09:51 - 01 Oct 2019 09:55 #38499 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
This topic has generated a lot of interest and rightly so. You normally don't get to see the inside of a Cord trunk. One other problem with the Westchester trunk is lack of storage space. There is a void between the spare wheel and the RHS of the
body. This can be accessed by removing the spare wheel but that is a chore. I modified my trunk shelf so that it has a removable section in the RHS above the void. It is hidden away by the carpet over the shelf.
To access the compartment you just have to pull back the carpet and remove the lid. There is a lot of space for a screw jack, modern hub cap removing tool, heaps of other tools and spares. I also fitted a small panel so that the stored items would not damage the fuel tank filler sleeve.
This leaves the rest of the trunk free for everything else or clear for car shows.

T cockerell
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Last edit: 01 Oct 2019 09:55 by Terry Cockerell. Reason: Adding pictures and revising text
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01 Oct 2019 02:57 #38497 by 1748 S
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Well said... VERY WELL SAID...


Gary Parsons

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  • john mccall
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01 Oct 2019 02:40 #38496 by john mccall
Replied by john mccall on topic 810 trunk interior
i agree with Jonathan that this thread is excellent. We are getting lots of good info on 810/812 trunks, mostly in the form of pictures which can be very helpful to restore your car. However if you try to accomplish a restoration based only on the pics you will quickly come up with many questions on details that the pics don't completely answer. That's where Rick Hulett would come in to fill in the details. Hopefully if we can pull enough info on this web we can get our officials to work toward getting Rick's treasure.of information. which also includes interior upholstery ( trim ) and tops for phaetons and cabriolets. The trunk trim details are complex enough to warrant a thread like this one . The interior trim would fill another and the top a third. I would like to see all of Rick's info preserved by our officials, but the next best thing would be having 3 separate threads in his area of expertise with as many pics and sketches and words as our membership can contribute.
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30 Sep 2019 17:59 #38494 by Jonathan Richards
Replied by Jonathan Richards on topic 810 trunk interior
Thanks you , Michael Rohde , for weighing in on this fascinating thread w/ Post #38493. As I am familiar with the history of your Cord S#1704A ( formerly owned by Glenn Pray) and have physically inspected the car prior to your purchasing it here in St. Louis, Missouri , USA , I believe the trunk interior upholstery is original. So much of your car is exactly that -- Original. Respecting the photo images posted by Rum Runner ( Post #38485 ) the trunk interior images are from his 1937 Cpord Model C-96 supercharged Beverly S#32410S. I previous owned that vehicle and believe that the trunk upholstery is NOT original but was skillfully installed by previous owner Col. Leonard Redburn during his meticulous restoration. It is a lovely car as Rum Runner knows. This thread is most excellent. Keep the posts coming, Thanks.

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30 Sep 2019 16:47 #38493 by Michael R
Replied by Michael R on topic 810 trunk interior
some pics of my unrestored 36 Westchester Nr. 704 Dimensions visible. The carpet has got a linnen protection arround and may have been nailed to the wooden platform



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30 Sep 2019 09:15 #38490 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
Hi Michael.
Thanks for posting these pictures. There is only one Beverly that I know of in Australia and it has been customised to some extent. Others will have to comment on these pictures.
Can you add a picture of the inside of the trunk lid please???
Thanks,
Terry Cockerell
Australia

T cockerell

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30 Sep 2019 09:07 #38489 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
No problem John, you are forgiven. The striped panel that goes behind the rear seat seems to be completely wasted. I know the lines are supposed to face forwards however I turned mine around ............................... at least you can see some of them when the spare wheel is lifted out but you would probably need a torch.

T cockerell

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30 Sep 2019 00:42 #38485 by RumRunner
Replied by RumRunner on topic 810 trunk interior
All,

Thought I would capture and post pictures of the trunk fabric in my 812 Beverly. No idea if it is original but sure looks like it to me. Hope these can be of some help.

-Michael







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30 Sep 2019 00:36 #38484 by john mccall
Replied by john mccall on topic 810 trunk interior
Terry,
I stand corrected. There are 2 jute panels, one on the back side of the rear seat with lines facing forward, and another at the front of the trunk with lines facing rearward. I will have to make sure I refresh my memory by looking at what I did before commenting the next time.

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29 Sep 2019 15:22 - 29 Sep 2019 15:25 #38479 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior
Just a thought as we seem to be on the train tracks heading in the right direction - perhaps this page becomes the Holy Grail of trunk knowledge - please keep posting everything you have. I say this as Curt Schulze and I would kill for this kind of knowledge regarding trunks for 34-36 Auburns - especially tire in the trunk cars with the bump out add on trunks - we worked really hard for years to get pretty close, but it was like one surviving feature on this car, one surviving feature on another car, lots of detective work, and ...

JMM
Last edit: 29 Sep 2019 15:25 by johnmereness.

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29 Sep 2019 10:25 - 29 Sep 2019 10:38 #38477 by Terry Cockerell
Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior
John there is a striped trunk lining panel behind the rear seat which is inside the car and then there is another striped panel in the trunk .
Check the attached layout diagram.
On another note I made a drawing of the wires that pass through the head lining which is full size and can be used to make new stays in stainless steel.

T cockerell
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29 Sep 2019 03:01 #38475 by john mccall
Replied by john mccall on topic 810 trunk interior
I didn't get chance to look at Marks trunk as I was soo'd away by one of the judges although I talked to him quite a bit and was very impressed with his knowledge of details. He did say that Rick Hulett went with him when he went to look at the Westchester.
I am surprised however that the lines show on the back side of the rear seat as Rick told me, and his installation instructions say, that the lines should face forward on that piece of material with the raw jute showing in the trunk. Since he didn't have a source for the raw jute he said just turn the piece so the lines face forward.

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29 Sep 2019 01:14 - 29 Sep 2019 01:19 #38474 by 1748 S
Replied by 1748 S on topic 810 trunk interior
My beverly has its original interior.If any pictures or information is requested in any detail I will share what I have. I do not have the front kick panels under the dash or any trunk lining. My headliner is complete down to the moth holes and the wire stays too. In 58 years of family ownership I have NEVER rolled it out to look it over completely.


Gary Parsons
Last edit: 29 Sep 2019 01:19 by 1748 S.

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29 Sep 2019 00:23 #38473 by john mccall
Replied by john mccall on topic 810 trunk interior
I have numerous emails from Rick this year, that contain pics of original phaeton trunk details, that I discussed very briefly with Jim O Brien at the reunion. He also indicated a willingness to try to correlate/summarize the info if I sent it to him. If we could get enough people to send in info that they have gathered from various sources it would be a step in the right direction. I believe getting it on the web is also the right direction.
Rick , trying to make a buck specializing in interiors, was at the same time extremely free with his knowledge and time, to individuals trying to restore their cars. Hats off to that attitude.
I can see that gathering restoration info is generally popular with those that read and replied to this forum. Is there also a more widely read forum that would reach more eyes?

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