810 trunk interior

wynlaidig
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06 Nov 2019 19:32 #38803 by wynlaidig

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Back to the original topic... attached are two original lined burlap pieces -- one from 810-1489F and the other from an 812 Beverly 310112S. Both cars have the original interior and both burlap pieces have the finer line spacing.

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wcoye
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06 Nov 2019 14:54 #38799 by wcoye

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Just thinking...What we've created here is essentially a restoration manual. It's cool that there has been so many contributions and soooooo m.any hits.
I've noticed that the restoration manual topic has laid fallow formany years . Would it make any sense to gather what has been gathered here (yes, poor use of sentence structure) and with some judicious editing and post it in the restoration manual category?
I enjoy searching through post to find an answer but often I'm in a hurry and have cull through a lot of stuff to find what I need to know. Whadya think?

Bill Coye
Westchester 2240A
Brag line: Winner of the
2014 Hillsborough Concurs Strother MacMinn award

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STEVEN.KUIPER
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06 Nov 2019 13:40 #38797 by STEVEN.KUIPER

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thinking a bit more on this. a friend who was a corvette expert was judging a car with the owner watching. he felt under the front fender and let out a slight hummm. the owner immediately started to get excited. the owner wanted to know what was wrong. my friend said this car has had an incorrect repair in the past. shouting immediately ensued. well once things calmed down the owner admitted he knew about the repair.
judges have a tough job. revealing flaws on the show field sometimes can become a bit dangerous but, it would be nice for owners to know what they need to correct too. perhaps, a form sent after show day.

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06 Nov 2019 06:41 #38795 by Terry Cockerell

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Mike, no wonder there are 2,518 hits on this site so far.

T cockerell

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06 Nov 2019 04:48 #38794 by mikespeed35

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The inspectors around here get paid for each visit! Now you know the answer.
CORDiallyMike

Mike Huffman

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05 Nov 2019 14:59 #38789 by wcoye

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Strongly agreed!

Bill Coye
Westchester 2240A
Brag line: Winner of the
2014 Hillsborough Concurs Strother MacMinn award

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05 Nov 2019 14:07 #38788 by STEVEN.KUIPER

Replied by STEVEN.KUIPER on topic 810 trunk interior

i've done quite a few building projects over the years.... almost exclusively on homes over 100 years old. one particular story might have some relevance here. the plumbing and heating inspector comes in to look over a newly installed furnace and duct work. he says" i'll never pass this till you fix the problems." and leaves. the furnace guys ( who had 30 years experience) scratch their heads look the job over and change a couple things. inspector comes back. same comment. they try a couple different things. same comment. finally they ask the inspector what he wants? he says, " i'm not here to do your job for you." after more trial & error they finally made him happy. wouldn't it have been more efficient if he had told them what was "wrong" on the first trip. that would have saved him 5 more trips to that job site.
if a given car clubs goal is to preserve & improve the remaining vehicles out there....we should provide as much help as is feasible to forward that goal. not all of us are interested in making a show car. however, i think most would like to raise the authenticity of the car they have. anything the club car do along those lines will have long term benefits to the body of remaining vehicles ...which will probably out live us.

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04 Nov 2019 00:17 #38779 by 1748 S

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Tim, I have to agree with you on the way we view restored cars today.Many years back I was so disappointed to learn having a car judged you never got to see where you was marked down. How can an owner bring a car to the best restored standard if they have no idea what or where to improve. I take my hat off to the many hard working club members that have worked tireless hours to bring about these welcomed changes.I really enjoyed watching, listening and asking questions at the recent west coast meet where you mock judged Randy's Beverly. Sadly I should have videoed it.

Gary Parsons

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03 Nov 2019 23:20 #38778 by Tim Gilmartin

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Terry: Mary is listed with her husband, Tom Dudley in Michigan. She wanted to start a restoration manual for 810/812 Cords, but it never got off the ground. I remember seeing something in regard to the gas tank fill area years ago.
Best to contact her and maybe it can be posted here.
I have to give a shout out to Mark Tomei and Allan McCrary (and many others) for all their hard work on the new restoration standards for all three Marques.
Tim.

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03 Nov 2019 21:25 #38777 by Terry Cockerell

Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior

Hi Tim, contributions are the key here. Quite a while ago I made contact with Mary Kileen ( I think I have the spelling right however she is not listed in the Directory) and she sent me a copy of the details on how to set up the petrol door area on a Cord. The details are extensive and quite precise.
Have other areas in Cords been covered with similar restoration guidelines?
If yes, how can they be accessed by the members?

T cockerell

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03 Nov 2019 18:23 #38776 by Tim Gilmartin

Replied by Tim Gilmartin on topic 810 trunk interior

Thanks to the internet, the Club’s website, and contributor members, this is how we improve the breed! From what I’ve seen since the start of the new judging standards, ACD cars coming in for judging, are much improved.
I continue to learn about these great cars.
Thank you all for your interest and contributions of knowledge and pictures!
CORDially, Tim.

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02 Nov 2019 00:14 #38766 by john mccall

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Well, it looks like Cord had more than one buckle supplier during their production time period . I don't know what SN my buckles came from, How about the other 2 examples.

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01 Nov 2019 06:13 #38762 by johnmereness

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This buckle does not have the bend in it either - I would assume Auburn and Cord used same components to a point given same body manufacturer

JMM

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01 Nov 2019 06:02 #38760 by johnmereness

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Here is a tool roll strap from a 1936 Auburn 852 Phaeton - I will take a better picture of it ASAP.

JMM

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01 Nov 2019 05:57 - 01 Nov 2019 05:58 #38759 by johnmereness

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I am wondering if the fuel tank filler neck covering was the same tan canvas as used for the tool rolls. I would call it a tan lightweight denim. The top material would be identifiable given it has a rubberized later between the inner and outer layers of canvas. A "duck" for the top would be single ply and very light weight - it was used for cosmetics in tops as interior trim. I have played around enough with this stuff that if someone would show me a piece of the filler neck material in person I could probably figure it out.

JMM

Last edit: 01 Nov 2019 05:58 by johnmereness.

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01 Nov 2019 01:34 #38758 by john mccall

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The filler tube material looks different without the close up on the trunk side.(the lines really don't show up that much}. Earlier this year Rick was using tan/black top material for this application. Black on the filler side/tan on the trunk side. The small piece of original filler material that I have, has the rust wire lines as yours , but could have been the original Hartz cloth which was a green/grey on the outside .
I also have a couple of original jack straps with the stock rusty washers. Judging from the fact that my latch has the same configuration that yours does, neither is bent. That was the configuration that was used, and it works fine after almost 80 years. P.S. My son had me convinced mine was bent also, until I saw the pic of yours.

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01 Nov 2019 01:00 #38756 by john mccall

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Except for the piece of jute that was on the back of the rear seat which was just jute, all of the trunk lining material was faced with a burlap material to which the lines were added. The exact coloring of either material in 1936 will probably never be known as time ages both the coloration and the material. My son recently acquired some of the jute backing material which is basically grey in color.
Rick went thru about 3 different suppliers over the course of time that he supplied the trunk kits. The face sheet with the lines changed with was available and economical. The jute backing to which the face sheet was adhered became basically illegal (Uncle Sam thought someone might smoke it},
Rick always tried to simulate the original material with affordable available materials.

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31 Oct 2019 21:24 - 31 Oct 2019 21:25 #38754 by wynlaidig

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Thanks Tim, That makes sense.

Last edit: 31 Oct 2019 21:25 by wynlaidig.

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31 Oct 2019 21:23 #38753 by wynlaidig

Replied by wynlaidig on topic 810 trunk interior

Right, but fresh new burlap has a yellow golden color, like newly harvested wheat. So the question is whether is was naturally yellowish golden or whether they actually used died burlap to begin with.

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31 Oct 2019 21:23 #38752 by Tim Gilmartin

Replied by Tim Gilmartin on topic 810 trunk interior

Hi Wyn: Yes, that one side was nice; but take a look at the fill side. Pretty gnarly. The nice looking fine line material is not the same as the burlap. All the burlap material had the “natural” color jute backing it.
Tim.

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31 Oct 2019 21:19 #38751 by Terry Cockerell

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Rick Hulett told me that all of the trunk lining material had the same yellowish golden background colour but it had faded with time.
I believe the striped material with the fine lines in Tim Gilmartin's picture is the outside of the fuel tank filler pipe sleeve.

T cockerell

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31 Oct 2019 17:54 #38749 by wynlaidig

Replied by wynlaidig on topic 810 trunk interior

Also, do we have any real evidence to know whether the background jute was natural color or whether it was died a yellow/gold as I see some people use? Every original jute I have seen seems to be natural colored to me, just with black lines on it.

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31 Oct 2019 02:34 #38743 by wynlaidig

Replied by wynlaidig on topic 810 trunk interior

I am not quite clear on the 2 lined burlap photos (with rulers) from Tim Gilmartin. Are BOTH supposed to be original, or is only the wider lined one original? The finer lined one looks too new and crisp to be original to me.

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29 Oct 2019 05:26 #38723 by johnmereness

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Thanks Tim ! I hope you do not mind, I moved your photos and text over to the trunk page started a few days ago. Interestingly, the strap looks to be made of a different material than an Auburn (I will have to look more close). I think the buckle on the tool strap may be partially bent. Sidenote: Tim's car was my first ride in 36/37 Cord.

JMM

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29 Oct 2019 05:19 #38721 by johnmereness

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Tim Gilmartin wrote: Picture of gas fill tube covering; note rust from wires that held it on the tube. Jack hold down straps with flat washers still stuck to the webbing.

JMM

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29 Oct 2019 05:18 #38720 by johnmereness

Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

Tim Gilmartin wrote: Picture of backing material for the burlap; note faint outline of the “x” cross member of the back seat. Burlap with finer lines. Non burlap lined material was on the trunk side of the gas fill tube cloth wrap. The gas fill tube side is a tan/olive drab color.
Tim.

JMM

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29 Oct 2019 05:16 #38719 by johnmereness

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Tim Gilmartin wrote: Here are some pics of my trunk material as found on my Westchester in 1992. I have no reason to believe that this is not original material.

JMM

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27 Oct 2019 16:12 #38708 by johnmereness

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And, always curious about tool rolls and tool.

JMM

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27 Oct 2019 16:11 #38707 by johnmereness

Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

Also, notice on Mark Clayton's car the bolt that holds the spare tire bracket has a "marked" head - on an Auburn the bolts are all Black Oxide or Parkerized finish, though on a Cord the marked bolts are plated.

JMM

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27 Oct 2019 16:06 - 27 Oct 2019 16:10 #38706 by johnmereness

Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

As a sidenote, I would think the original installation had a certain number of nails - they probably did glue a portion, but obviously glues then was not of best longevity. The diagram on page 3 notes a certain number of nails. They probably also used a number of drive nails to hold the carpet to the floor - I see some "divots" in the carpet on Mark Clayton's car and assume them to be drive nails.

JMM

Last edit: 27 Oct 2019 16:10 by johnmereness.

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27 Oct 2019 15:49 - 27 Oct 2019 15:59 #38705 by johnmereness

Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

Michael, Thank You !!! The photos explain perfectly and very much appreciated. I would not have guessed that is what I was looking at. I think we now have a pretty complete page for how to do a trunk, excepting your car is short one or two pieces of carpet or .... In the compliments department one fine automobile !

JMM

Last edit: 27 Oct 2019 15:59 by johnmereness.

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26 Oct 2019 18:43 #38695 by Michael R

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some pics arround the corner. the cloth is fastened with some nails wich I do not really want to remove

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26 Oct 2019 15:51 - 26 Oct 2019 16:08 #38694 by johnmereness

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Hello, hoping that you are not totally frustrated with me, though I am having trouble figuring out the panel that is in the lower center portion of this photo - it appears to go around the corner and I see it has some sewing on the edge (and a nail in it) and equally does not have the jute backing. I really hate to ask, though would it be possible to do another photo more toward the upper corner of what this piece does - I do not think I am seeing it on the sketch on page 3. I did go on a couple hour crusade yesterday to find the "C" shaped clip on the non-buckle end of the tool strap (using your photos). Amazing this all survived - I had a 1941 Cadillac 60 Special with 14K miles on it and the trunk was not this nice.

JMM

Last edit: 26 Oct 2019 16:08 by johnmereness.

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25 Oct 2019 20:19 #38692 by Michael R

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some pics arround the hinges

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24 Oct 2019 13:52 - 24 Oct 2019 13:52 #38683 by johnmereness

Replied by johnmereness on topic 810 trunk interior

Awesome trunk pictures. And, awesome car - not many survive in this state - needle in a haystack !!! I know this is a lot to ask, though could you do two more photos to see a little more detail looking from the trunk floor up at the top corners of the trunk around the hinges R & L which I would assume to be mirrors of each other. Interesting how they have the screws visible on the straps - not as finished as if they had screws on inside, yet screws probably then would damage the tool bag). Thank you again for the help.

JMM

Last edit: 24 Oct 2019 13:52 by johnmereness.

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23 Oct 2019 20:27 #38675 by Terry Cockerell

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Hi Michael, thanks for these wonderful pictures. It is astonishing that it had all survived. It sets a benchmark for restorations.
Kindest regards,
Terry Cockerell
Australia

T cockerell

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23 Oct 2019 19:24 #38674 by Michael R

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trunk lid

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23 Oct 2019 19:21 #38673 by Michael R

Replied by Michael R on topic 810 trunk interior

so on

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23 Oct 2019 19:18 #38672 by Michael R

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just an old dirty trunk...

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22 Oct 2019 14:41 #38660 by johnmereness

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Would it be possible to poke your camera into all the corners upper, lower. front, back, and etc., plus all four corners of trunk lid too - Your appear to be the fore-leader in how a proper trunk should be done - more or less you are the "history detective."?

JMM

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Michael R
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20 Oct 2019 19:19 #38639 by Michael R

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Jonathan Richards wrote: Mr. Richards, 1937 Cord S#32410S , which you previously owned , is a Beverly sedan and NOT a Phaeton. Foolish old man. You should know better , and used to. The other Mr. Richards with clearer brain.

Dear Mr. Richards, it is the best sign of a good charakter if you can make a joke about your own mistakes! you are a great man!

to John Mereness, wich details do you want? I´ll do my very best to help

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20 Oct 2019 02:17 #38635 by Jonathan Richards

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Mr. Richards, 1937 Cord S#32410S , which you previously owned , is a Beverly sedan and NOT a Phaeton. Foolish old man. You should know better , and used to. The other Mr. Richards with clearer brain.

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20 Oct 2019 01:36 - 20 Oct 2019 03:52 #38634 by Terry Cockerell

Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior

Hi Jack, I agree entirely with your comments. I have attached a picture which shows three material samples.
In the background is the original piece from behind the rear seat, it has thick black lines.
To the RHS is the sample supplied by Rick Hulett which has thin black lines with a finer pattern.
At the lower LHS is the material I made up. It is based on the original sample but I made the lines too thin. I was not looking at the bigger picture at the time. With care I can salvage the job by redrawing the lines thicker.
So we have two distinct line patterns, one with thick lines in early production cars and one with fine lines in later production cars.
I believe the background colour was all the same. The sample of the original material in the picture has faded a lot.
My Cord has Serial No 1586 A, I have no idea when the line pattern changed.

T cockerell

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Last edit: 20 Oct 2019 03:52 by Terry Cockerell. Reason: Adding picture. Spelling error

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19 Oct 2019 19:42 #38631 by Jonathan Richards

Replied by Jonathan Richards on topic 810 trunk interior

I very much dislike pouring cold water on an attempt to provide original trunk interior upholstery , HOWEVER , as I earlier posted on this thread the trunk interior views posted by Rum Runner on this post and #38485 are of 1937 Cord Supercharged Phaeton S # 32410S , of which I was a previous owner. It was restored by the late Col. Leonard Redburn of Missouri and it was he who installed the present excellent trunk upholstery. Sorry to be a spoiler , but we need to search for and find original upholstery examples in both Cord and Auburn marques to assure the accuracy of our restorations.

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19 Oct 2019 18:43 #38629 by johnmereness

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RumRunner wrote: All,

May, I talk you into more trunk photos too, including trunk floor and ...) ?

Thought I would capture and post pictures of the trunk fabric in my 812 Beverly. No idea if it is original but sure looks like it to me. Hope these can be of some help.

-Michael

JMM

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19 Oct 2019 18:39 - 19 Oct 2019 18:40 #38628 by johnmereness

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Michael R wrote: some pics of my unrestored 36 Westchester Nr. 704 Dimensions visible. The carpet has got a linnen protection arround and may have been nailed to the wooden platform

May I talk you into sticking your head into your trunk and doing some more detailed photos (including some overall, in corners, and ... ) ?

JMM

Last edit: 19 Oct 2019 18:40 by johnmereness.

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04 Oct 2019 09:22 - 04 Oct 2019 09:49 #38548 by Terry Cockerell

Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior

A kind thought Mike. Her name is spelt Zoey and she is quite a character heading for her tenth birthday after Christmas.
While Gai and I were in the Auburn Hospital in 2018 Zoey was in the Grand Parade with her friends the Butler family. She had a ball in the Butler's 1919 Auburn tourer.
I have already experimented with redrawing the lines and think it will work out ok.
The attached pictures show Zoey on the left with Taylor on the right
Cheers from Down Under,
Terry, Gai and Zoey

T cockerell

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Last edit: 04 Oct 2019 09:49 by Terry Cockerell. Reason: Adding picture and revising text

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04 Oct 2019 04:22 #38547 by mikespeed35

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Maybe Zoie can help you with the lines Terry. Sorry for probably spelling her name wrong.
CORDiallyMike

Mike Huffman

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04 Oct 2019 01:54 - 04 Oct 2019 01:55 #38544 by Terry Cockerell

Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior

Trunk Carpet Clips.
Having only one of the original clips in my trunk I was delighted to discover new clips and eyelets are available from Restoration Specialities in Winberg PA
They are called BURCO Clips.
Double Stud #8 X 3/4" ......................... Part No B112
Eyelet .......................................................... Part No B158
Washer ........................................................ Part No B33
Two sets are required.

T cockerell

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Last edit: 04 Oct 2019 01:55 by Terry Cockerell. Reason: Adding picture

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03 Oct 2019 22:15 #38541 by Terry Cockerell

Replied by Terry Cockerell on topic 810 trunk interior

Bill you are among friends and a lot closer to Auburn than I am. It is a step by step process but you will get there in the end. Rethinking my trunk lining dilemma regarding the true line spacing I think I can salvage the situation by redrawing the black lines and making them wider. I will do some more experimenting first but I think I will leave the job until the rest of the car is finished and on the road otherwise it will never get on the road. Just as well I made the panels removable.
Perhaps you can get Tim to copy and email you your judging sheet?

T cockerell

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