Seeking advice...

Thanks for sharing these wonderful pictures. Your father looks very happy and he should be with those first class restorations to his credit. The best part is that he is still there to enjoy them.

Age has nothing to do with anything, but unrealistic expectations and vision does have everything to do with it (and a lot of it revolves around the specialized people required and the cost). So, someone is going to recreate something that took literally thousands of people to build to begin with ...

Great story and a wonderful looking shop. I see a P38 hanging from the ceiling... Is that his planes? Are they Royal kits or BV or???


Gary Parsons

To sort of stay on topic, besides the car below that took almost 60s to finish, he did start and finish projects later in life. The Auburn below was pretty much full restored mechanically with minor cosmetics in about 5 years. He started when he was 75 or so.

I think it depends on your energy level and enthusiasm. You don't necessarily have to finish the project either, if you are having fun along the way and you don't sink your entire net worth in to it.

Everybody needs a reason to get out of bed in the morning.

That is a pretty inspirational story. 96 and still working on his toys. I hope like a lot of other people to do much the same thing however we all won't be so lucky.
George Van Nostrand recently celebrated his 92 nd and is sill actively restoring his second Westchester. His first is in Australia.
Any chance of a recent picture of you dad with the Packard?

Terry Cockerell wrote: 55 years to restore an Auburn, that must be a record.

M
After reading Jim's comments on restoration time, the decision is obvious.
Good luck.

My dad bought is 35 Packard in 1959 and has been restoring it every since. It was "finished" a couple of years ago - at least enough to win BOS at Greenwich, but we are still working on the fuel system so that you can actually drive it more than a mile.

Also, he will be 96 this summer, so he must have calculated a long lifespan in to his restoration schedule.

DONALD.ELMER wrote: Mike... add 55 to 15 and you will get an approximate answer. Regardless, I have the energy to take on another project but I am not signing up for a vow of poverty. I want to remain married after all.

With all this information in mind...Maybe it would be a better idea to restore this car to a survivor type driver. Make is a safe driver but try to leave the rest of the car as is. Leaving a car in an unrestored condition is a very nice prize on any show ground. If the original paint is still on the car and its "okay" just leave it as is. This club and these members that have posted help would love to see pictures no matter the condition.Posting the serial number plate and the actual engine numbers is a terrific idea.It tells volumes about this car. I know I would like to see pictures. Back in 2016 I received an email from a collector restorer wanting to see my car. This person was very well known around the ACD club. I'm a minor player in this world of ACD cars. It took a year before I allowed this viewing to happen. That person was Randy Ema who is known world wide for his Duesenberg restoration and knowledge. We have been friends ever since.We go to lunch every few months and talk cars.


Gary Parsons

Mike... add 55 to 15 and you will get an approximate answer. Regardless, I have the energy to take on another project but I am not signing up for a vow of poverty. I want to remain married after all.

Donald that puts things in perspective. Go for the Cord ............... it needs saving anyway as it is not in a barn. There are heaps of people who will help along the way.

One very important thing no one has mentioned. "HOW OLD ARE YOU". Not really asking you, but depending on the answer you may give the executor of your estate a real head ache!
CORDiallyMike

Bought the car at age 15... got it running by 17...off to college then career, kids and all that... the car sat in my garage until early 2019 when I finally focused on it. A wonderful experience.

Donald, I must apologise if I sounded a bit short in my previous reply, however 55 years is a long time to complete a restoration. If the Cord phaeton has been sitting out in the open for a long time the floors and structural body members must be in a mess consequently it would take a huge effort to bring it back.
I have been restoring a Westchester that I previously had on the road. The restoration is approaching 6 years and I am certain that I would not tackle another one. I have an understanding wife .................. but there are limits.
As Tim mentioned it would be good to know the identification numbers.
It may well be another unknow survivor.

Hi Donald: The Club is always on the lookout for “unknown” Cords. If your find was a barn find, then I/we would like to get some details.
If you can, please: the serial number and engine number may be on a plate on the right side of the cowl with the hood open. Just below that should be the Central Manufacturing plate which tells the body number. Also, on a boss on the left front of the engine block would be a stamped engine number, starting with FB or FC.
Thank you! Tim.

55 years to restore an Auburn, that must be a record.
After reading Jim's comments on restoration time, the decision is obvious.
Good luck.

Hi Donald,
The two big items on a Cord restoration are time and money.

A Cord will take two to three times as long to restore as any other car. Most people don't beleive this when I tell them but come back afterwords and say I was light on the time frame.

Next is money. If the car is fairly complete and solid you are talking $70K - $100K if you do most of the work yourself. The price goes up quickly the more parts you need, etc.
Engine - $10 for machining and parts - you assemble. $20K to $25K for someone else to do. Add $10K for S/C
Transmission - $10K - Have someone who has done several of these rebuild it for you or the cost is going to be much higher
Interior - $15K
Paint - $10K - if you do all the prep and get the car in primer
Chrome - $10K for decent chrome
Misc. parts - $15K

The Club has the techinical resources to get the job done and teh great thing about this club is people are willing to share the information. You will learn who to listen to and deal with and who not to.

For a regular Cord it is far cheaper to buiy one done and then tinker with it then it is to restore it. I say this as I am retoring a phaeton myself. THe up side is when I get done the car will done correctly and the way I want it.

Good luck whatever you decide.

Hi Gary,
Thanks for taking the time to list your priorities for a Cord Phaeton restoration... very useful. I do not own the car yet... and may never, but I am giving this project serious consideration. The car is in sad shape today--a barn find without the barn would be a good way to describe it.

I probably should have my head examined but I've always been attracted to restoration projects. My 1933 Auburn 8-105 had been used as a chicken coop when I got it about 55 years ago... today it's nearing completion. Most of my satisfaction comes from the "doing" versus the "driving" and I am a perfectionist. This said, I'm not prepared to have an open checkbook simply for the thrill.

I'll keep you posted as my consideration continues. Thanks again.

Don

Hi Donald.
To start with what condition is your phaeton in?
Also what are you aiming at, a driver, show car or both?
If it is complete and driveable it is a lot easier than trying to restore a wreck. The engine and gearbox are major jobs in themselves however there are a lot of people who can help and machine shops to do various jobs.
If you have a rough rusty body a lot of skilled work is required. If the body does not look so good when finished with respect to door alignment etc it kind of kills the end result. If attention is given to everything you will end up with a good looking reliable Cord.
Can you post some pictures to give us an idea of what you have?

I think rebuilding the transmission is going to be the top issue you may find. Be careful when purchasing any gears. there are some "soft" gears made in the 1950's by Dalas Winslow that looked great. But ended up too soft. I purchased all my needed gears from Goerge Arakelian.Our club has a couple of members that have "made gears" that are very high qualiry. We also have severl members that are very good at rebuilding these transmissions. Next is finding a qualified engine builder. I plan using a one man shop here in Whittier Ca named Engine Parts Service. Curt is the owner and has rebuilt many Duesenberg engines for Randy ema. I have toured his shop and it can do what I expect. I think Chrome is the next thing that can be difficult to find.... Its nearly an outlawed business here in California.Then finding the correct paint color has givien others a ruff time.Several members have the original color chip books or talk with Stan Gulliand in Wellingron Kansas. He was a painter before he because the Auburn Cord Parts business he is for so many of us restoring our cars. About the easiest item is the wiring harness. I prefer Rhode Island Wiring in Rhode Island. But when it comes to the transmission harness tell them you want to one piece harness. Our original harness came as a two piece harness that had a plug just below the firewall. The harness is a 10 wire harness. So, that creates 40 different wire connections that can short or cause the trans not to shift correctly. Our trans os shifted by electric and vacuum. We do NOT have any "feel" like a coloume or floor shifter feel.. When things go bad in the trans its very costly. I think finall finding someone that can replace the leather interior is the last thing. This ACD club can direct you to all the special places to have work done or where to purchase parts. In my personal resooration I want to do it once. and do it right.


Gary Parsons

I'm contemplating the restoration of a '36 Cord Phaeton and have read the comments from many people who have undertaken such a project. So for all of you who have an opinion, I'd like to know what you think are the five or six most challenging steps that are involved in such a project. I have some experience with restoration and would attempt to do as much as possible myself. Quite simply, I am trying to prioritize my due diligence and focus on the most likely problem areas. Looking forward to hearing from one and all...