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How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?

  • Curt Schulze
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09 Sep 2019 17:05 #38244 by Curt Schulze
Replied by Curt Schulze on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
Those lines are not for cooling , but heater lines. Used in cold weather as a substitute for a manifold heat riser. Notice the input is in the back of the head and ends in the input to the water pump.

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
Be of Good Cheer
Curt

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  • johnmereness
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08 Sep 2019 14:55 - 13 Sep 2019 15:50 #38234 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
As a sidenote, the 1935 851 S/C Phaeton dad and one of his salespeople had in the 1970's was eventually converted this way when the supercharger blew up on the next owner - when we had the car you could accelerate and the supercharge housing would change color from porosity in the aluminum (they were still running coolant through it - we disconnected the coolant part, but it was still a bad casting at a time when no one was reproducing such).

Sidenote: Curt is correct in that I speak of coolant and coolant lines, but the running of water/antifreeze through supercharger is not meant to cool the supercharger - it is meant to be a preheater via lack of the exhaust manifold butterfly commonly found on exhaust manifold of a non-s/c car.

JMM
Last edit: 13 Sep 2019 15:50 by johnmereness.

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20 Aug 2019 23:12 #38052 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
I think Paul's car was more "yellow" in paint color with perhaps red interior and wheel disks too. Looks like same idea though.

JMM

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  • Curt Schulze
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20 Aug 2019 14:20 #38048 by Curt Schulze
Replied by Curt Schulze on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
Stan used to sell that conversion. Is that Paul Terhorst's car

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
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Curt

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  • ilikescars
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20 Aug 2019 14:10 - 20 Aug 2019 14:12 #38047 by ilikescars
G-T: It looks from that picture that your car was converted from standard to supercharged appearance. There are no s/c intake manifolds, no supercharger and you have a non-s/c carb. & air cleaner. My guess is that someone liked the appearance of the external pipes and built it that way.
Beautiful car, though!
Last edit: 20 Aug 2019 14:12 by ilikescars.

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20 Aug 2019 13:55 - 20 Aug 2019 13:58 #38046 by ilikescars
This is off-subject, but I just had a S/C counterbalanced crank made-up by SCAT in California. Perfectly fits 35-36 Auburn Lycoming engines. They now have all the specs, so the cost is not too high.
I also have the patterns to make S/C exhaust manifolds, (exact reproduction).
Last edit: 20 Aug 2019 13:58 by ilikescars. Reason: error

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  • Curt Schulze
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17 Aug 2019 15:22 #38035 by Curt Schulze
Replied by Curt Schulze on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
Can't tell anything from that pix . look at the dataplate on the other side.
If you get your car judged, there are a few points that will get knocked off.

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
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Curt

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  • G-T
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16 Aug 2019 15:56 #38031 by G-T

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  • Curt Schulze
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16 Aug 2019 11:50 #38030 by Curt Schulze
Replied by Curt Schulze on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
There are numbers on the block. Numbers on the RH front side of the frame and these numbers are on the cowl tag.

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
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Curt

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  • G-T
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15 Aug 2019 14:08 #38029 by G-T
So where exactly is located that serial number and what special code or number or letter should I look for?

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  • Curt Schulze
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01 Aug 2019 21:21 #37933 by Curt Schulze
Replied by Curt Schulze on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
There is a manifold A90536 to eliminate external pipes on s/c cars. There were no non s/c engines fitted with external pipes from the factory.

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
Be of Good Cheer
Curt
The following user(s) said Thank You: 1748 S, johnmereness

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  • rlwardne
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01 Aug 2019 15:50 #37930 by rlwardne
There seem to be a lot of secrets. ;)
The following user(s) said Thank You: AuburnNut

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01 Aug 2019 15:43 #37929 by rlwardne
I thought I remembered reading in the book that some customers requested and got the external pipes. But that may be fogged onto my mind for the Cord

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01 Aug 2019 11:50 #37927 by Curt Schulze
Replied by Curt Schulze on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
So are the crankshafts Mike. To my knowledge the oil pans have not been repo'd, but there is a mod to them that can be made. There is one other thing, but I'm not tellin.

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
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Curt

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  • mikespeed35
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01 Aug 2019 04:09 #37926 by mikespeed35
Supercharged cars had counterbalanced crankshafts. Most other parts are being reproduced, even the oil pans.
CORDiallyMiike

Mike Huffman

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  • johnmereness
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31 Jul 2019 22:19 #37921 by johnmereness
Replied by johnmereness on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
And no you cannot get S/C exhaust without the supercharger (there are a few cars that exist, though each has its own story of how it came to be what it is).

JMM

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  • Curt Schulze
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31 Jul 2019 12:42 #37913 by Curt Schulze
Replied by Curt Schulze on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
The frame number will be a clue.

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
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Curt

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  • rlwardne
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31 Jul 2019 02:23 #37909 by rlwardne
I believe you could get the S/C exhaust without the supercharger

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  • ilikescars
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31 Jul 2019 00:10 #37908 by ilikescars
If you think the car has it's original frame, there is a quick way of determining if the car came from the factory as a s/c configuration.

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31 Jul 2019 00:06 - 31 Jul 2019 00:12 #37907 by ilikescars
My error, sorry Curt!
Last edit: 31 Jul 2019 00:12 by ilikescars. Reason: error

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31 Jul 2019 00:06 #37906 by ilikescars
stamped on top of engine block, next to head, Front left (driverside) corner.
Having a GH engine does not necessarily mean that it came from the factory that way, however.

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  • G-T
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30 Jul 2019 13:54 #37903 by G-T
Where are those engine numbers punched?
I will post very soon pictures of the original exhaust manifold from the NON supercharged one...

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  • Curt Schulze
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30 Jul 2019 12:36 #37901 by Curt Schulze
Replied by Curt Schulze on topic How to tell a real from a fake supercharged 850-851?
although S/C intake manifolds have not been reproduced.
Yes they have.

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
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Curt

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  • ilikescars
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29 Jul 2019 23:31 #37898 by ilikescars
Does your car have a serial number GG engine or a GH? I have seen cars that had been converted back to standard configuration.
There are reproduction parts available, although S/C intake manifolds have not been reproduced.
Also, there are other ways of determining if the car was a factory S/C. (A closely held secret.) I would have to see your car in person, however.
regards,
Mark Spandikow

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  • 1748 S
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29 Jul 2019 18:42 #37896 by 1748 S
This is the best web site to ask this question. I can't tell you what to look for but several members here will help.Pictures would be a great help too.


Gary Parsons

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  • G-T
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29 Jul 2019 16:44 #37895 by G-T
I presently have two supercharged Auburn in my shop, one is a certified one and the other one is having every original parts to make it look alike and since that there is even the originals exhaust manifold and piping, and since that it dosent seem like there are reproduction parts available I was wondering if this car was an original supercharged one that they had remove the supercharger or that somone had the chance to find all original parts to do the conversion? Any input would be very appreciate since that I am very intrigued by this situation...;Thanks.

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