Batteries

Stan,

Are there one of these smaller reduction unit starters that will fit a Lycoming V 8 and will it work on 6 v.? Would it?s presence ruin any chances for a good judging?

If someone did run an eight-volt all the factory electrics lifespan would be considerably shortened, and it?s not anything I would consider, of course I would have to confess I have jumpered a 6v. system to start in a pinch though!

Just look at the regulator connectors. Small screw terminals, and there are delicate points behind the metal cover. Nothing that can handle huge surges.

That reminds me also that modern cars should have the battery disconnected when doing any electric welding, the transistor laden computers can fry from the surges thru the body.

When the generator needs replacing from charging at the excessive 9v. rate and burnout occurs, the replacement will need to be polarized. Is the cord generator internally or externally grounded? An externally grounded unit would be polarized by momentarily jumpering a wire from the ?BAT? to the ?ARM? terminals of the voltage regulator. With an internally grounded generator, you would disconnect the field wire from the regulator and momentarily touch that wire to the regulator ?BAT? terminal. There are just two wires leading into the dash in my job.

I have an old Cord wiring diagram around here somewhere and the wiring pattern sould be apparent in the chart. My old generator seems to be working fine and I would never submit the 12 gauge cloth-covered wires to charge anything but a six-volt battery.

I have the early regulator mounted on the generator. It may be internally wired different than the firewall mounted regulator. At this point I am loosing confidence in my repair skills as there is so much at stake, I might mess up these soldered terminals and overheat the electrical system I will wait for further advice on or if this generator might need polarizing on replacement. I am working on replacing the ground strap and checking terminals for good connections.

balin' :rolleyes:

The 6-8 volt question on starting comes around every few years when we get a group of new owners. The problems associated with 8 volts is never worth the better? starting. The hard starting always lies with other problems that owners are unaware of or won't fix. Rings too tight, weak starters, poor grounds, undersize battery cables, human errors are 90% of the problem. Never mind that the technology of that era had some flaws in it. Today's starters are less than 1/2 the size of our old cars but they really spin these new high compression engines over. The root of the 8 volt problem is the generator has to put out 9.5 to 10 volts to charge an 8 volt battery. If you have just one poor connection and the charging system discovers it - bang - the generator goes wild. It can burn up a lot of bulbs, wires, armatures throw their solder, or on a Cord it can fry the entire electrical system. Let's fix the problem and not make it worse. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater - just get him clean and dry!

Stan

REGARDING WHAT JOSH SAID, ANTIQUE AUTO BATTERY IS NOW SELLING A BATTERY WHICH SUPPOSEDLY DOES EXACTLY WHAT HE SAYS EXCEPT YOU CAN KEEP YOUR 6V CHARGING SYSTEM AND ALL BULBS AS 6V.WHAT IT DOES IS ONLY DIRECTS 12V TO STARTER,WHICH IS FINE AS LONG AS YOU DON'T CRANK FOR EXTENDED PERIODS. THIS DEFINITELY INCREASES YOUR STARTERS PERFORMANCE. IT IS 2 6V BATTERIES IN THE SAME CASE WITH A SWITCH SUCH AS JOSH NOTED.

I've tried a number of ways to get Cord 810s to start well on hot summer days and cold mountain mornings. One of the methods used an Orpin switch, which connects two 6-volt batteries in series so the starter gets 12 volts, then reconnects in parallel so everything else sees only 6 volts.

I do not think that 8 volts is the way to go. Light bulbs burn out FAST (I mean in hours). Radios can be ruined without a reliable source of 6 volts, and resistors don't always do this. There are potential problem with guages, too. If you choose to change voltages 12 volts makes more sense. The starter will spin merrily, and most 12-volt bulbs fit in the same sockets as 6 volts. And, you can use every modern gadget that you can buy in your auto supply store. With a modern regulator your generator will happily supply 12 volts. There are even 12 volt Startixes.

I'm still happy with 6 volts. Here's how I do it:
1. I use 00 welding cable for the starter cables --- one to Startix, and one from the battery ground to a mounting bolt on the starter.
2. The terminals are installed by a place that has a crimping tool (4-foot handles!) that squeezes the terminal and cable wires into a virtual block of copper. No bolt-ons, no "swedged" crimps.
3. I rebuilt my starter, and used "hi-torque" field coils (designed for fork lifts) that makes the starter spin 10-15% faster.
4. I use an Optima battery.
5. For the past 12 years I've used a 6-volt alternator. Charges at idle, 50 amps max. You must convert to negative ground, no big deal.

Just my two cents. (There's a lot more in my 1995 book, "How To Maintain and enjoy your collector car", from Amazon, etc. Shameless plug

Balin,

Obviously there would be a deduction for a LPG conversion. As I said, if it can't be seen it can't be judged. That pretty much eliminates the fluids question (gas, coolants, brake fluid, etc.). Besides, judges don't conduct a chemical analysis on the fluids (at least not yet!). Nylon carpet is another subject; for expierenced judges, nylon versus the original wool is easy to pick up. You could get maximum points for condition and hefty deduction for non-authentic material such as nylon.

As for the battery issue ACD cars (as were virtually all cars in the '30's were shipped with 6 volt batteries not 8V). If you had two cars that were scored identically in judging the one with a 6V battery would win out over the other car with the 8V battery. That is just the way it is.

It is always interesting to discuss items of this nature and to get other peoples opinion in as much as it always helps to hear what other people think about judging topics.

CORDially,

Al Hatch

Al,

I would think there would be a deduction for the LPG conversion but surely not for something as insignificant as a four filler cell battery. Did they not have eight volt cells during that ?period? of time? A battery only has a two year shelf time so many stock batteries would have already been changed even before production ended.

Many original owners would have already have known of the eight volt swap trick. Is there a remaining working example of a stock sixty-five year old Cord battery remaining somewhere?

Possibly if there were two exact perfect cars judged, one with the six volt cell and one with an eight. Who would trophy between the two? A battery is a consumable, would there be deductions for use of unleaded fuel in the lines, silicone brake fluid, antifreeze or nylon carpet? :rolleyes:

balin'

John,

As they say, 'if it can't be seen, it can't be judged'. But if by some chance one of the judges ask to see if your car has the battery cover in place under the seat (for safety concerns) and inspects the battery and notes that there are four fill caps there could be a points deduction. As for the lamps, most 6 volt lamps carry a 6V-8V rating (at least the GE lamps do) and they can be found at any good full line stocking electrical wholesale house.

By the way, I agree with you on how quickly the cars start on an 8V battery. It surprising what two volts can do.

CORDially,

Al Hatch

Hello, I drive a Auburn 898 nearly every day. I run on LPG. I have 12v
alternater. all 12v bulbs. and never blow anything
Bob Hale England

JOHN
CARRY EXTRA TAIL AND HEADLAMP BULBS WITH YOU AS YOU WILL TEND TO BURN OUT BULBS MORE OFTEN WITH THE EXTRA VOLTAGE,NOT TERRIBLY BUT IT SEEMS THAT WAY IF YOU ARE DRIVING AT NIGHT.

As far as I'm concerned, not if it can't be seen, and you don't tell the judges.

Mike

I just got an 8 Volt battery for my Auburn and it makes a world of difference over a new 6 Volt one for starting! Are any judging points deducted for an 8 Volt battery?