Duesenberg Model J visit Birthplace of Fred & Augie

  • Bob Roller
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12 Jul 2011 23:16 #20493 by Bob Roller
Bob Roller replied the topic: High prices for cars,vintage or not
Matt,
Here in America it is not uncommon for bids to be made by people who can't afford lunch but are paid to make them on cars and a host of other items. They are called "Shills". This artificial inflation does the hobby NO good and I personally have a bad view of auctions of any kind. If somene has an item to sell,tell me the price and if it isn't ridiculous,I'll buy it. The car hobby seems to be one continuing auction and it takes me about 3 seconds to lose interest in matter what car is up on the block. I don't watch them.

Bob Roller

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13 Jul 2011 09:41 #20496 by landmark
landmark replied the topic: Re: High prices for cars,vintage or not

Bob Roller wrote: Matt,
Here in America it is not uncommon for bids to be made by people who can't afford lunch but are paid to make them on cars and a host of other items. They are called "Shills". This artificial inflation does the hobby NO good and I personally have a bad view of auctions of any kind. If somene has an item to sell,tell me the price and if it isn't ridiculous,I'll buy it. The car hobby seems to be one continuing auction and it takes me about 3 seconds to lose interest in matter what car is up on the block. I don't watch them.

Bob Roller


Hello Bob,

what I don't understand is, when a "Shill" "buys" the car (back to the owner/seller) there would be nevertheless the buyers fee (10%?) of the biddingprice to pay to the auctioneers company...
Or is there a collaboration/gentlemen agreement :rolleyes:between seller and auctioneer?

Matt

Was man besonders gerne tut,
ist selten ganz besonders gut

Wilhelm Busch

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13 Jul 2011 09:48 #20497 by Chris Summers
Chris Summers replied the topic:
What goes on behind the scenes is often best left there.

Last I knew the car in question was still for sale in the Netherlands, as you mentioned. A friend in the club visited it and said its restoration was still holding up extremely well, given its age. Harry Sherry does nice work.

Chris Summers
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Chandler-Cleveland Motor Club
CCCA

So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.

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13 Jul 2011 11:40 #20498 by Bob Roller
Bob Roller replied the topic: Buyer's fees usw
Matt,
Usually the "Shill" or inplanted bidder will start the bids and if a higher bid is offered,he stays quiet. As far as buyer's fees are concerned,it is possible that an arrangement has been made among the different parties.
As I said before,I despise auctions and am convinced that they have raped the hobby. If anyone who has something for sale can't figure out how to sell it without involving people with whom he or she has NO history (strangers) then there is a major problem. Major money has been lost that way and it is documented.

Bob Roller

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13 Jul 2011 17:05 #20499 by Mike Brady
Mike Brady replied the topic:
Harry Sherry's work is under-stated at best.

If you have the opportunity to study cars he restored 20 or more years ago in comparison to others....his work is outstanding. Of his few customers, most are repeat customers.

If one were in the market for an older restored MCC, I can see justification for a premium on a Sherry restoration.

His quality of restoration is the only reasonable explaination that the supercharged 812 CC he restored for a Michigan customer (in unusual colour) brought near record auction price.

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18 Aug 2011 14:42 #20758 by Cargirl
Cargirl replied the topic: J219
Whoa Whoa Guys - J219 is a perfectly wonderful Duesenberg with absolutely no issues. It is the real deal. I have been working with the owner for over a year and I am actually bringing him to Auburn over the Labor Day weekend to talk to other Duesenberg owners and to show him what real Duesenbergs sell for.

The story is this: My client bought the car from the last owner as an investment. He was not at the time a big fan of the cars but has, over the last year, grown to love them as much as we all do. That said, when he was approached by Bonham's to put the car at auction he agreed. These are his own words as we just talked about it again yesterday:

[i:3hxb2r5z]Point is, that Bonhams advised prior to the auction, that the car would go for 1.6 ? 1.8 mio euro. There was a reserve at 1.6.

At the auction itself I had the feeling something wasn?t right. The bidding for the 1.35 came by phone. Bonhams told me they couldn?t guarantee the credibility of this ?buyer?, because he is unknown to Bonhams?.

Depending on what I had experienced so far from the moment I set foot in Paris (after very, very long negotiations prior to the auction), I had the feeling there would be funny surprises if I would have said yes to this deal.[/i:3hxb2r5z]

[i:3hxb2r5z]So, Pim and Duesie lived happily ever after?.

BTW, the original engine is still mounted. Don?t know where that comes from?
[/i:3hxb2r5z]

So I have spent an entire year trying to convince him and teach him about the market for Duesenbergs. I am lining up interested buyers for him to meet at the festival and have told him that these meetings, and the auction results we are about to see from Monterey - should help us find the right price for his car.

Randy Ema knows this car. It is a good, solid car with a very honest and nice seller who has been mislead. I am going to send him this thread. Hopefully it will help educate him even further.

See you all at the Festival.

Kelly

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