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Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory

  • landmark
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24 Oct 2013 20:23 #26182 by landmark

Bob Roller wrote: I'm still waiting for an answer to this question.I can't believe that nobody on this forum has the answer.

Bob Roller


Hello Bob,

wrong thread <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: --> I think your unanswered question is in the thread "one below"


Kind Regards

Matt

Was man besonders gerne tut,
ist selten ganz besonders gut

Wilhelm Busch

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24 Oct 2013 15:05 #26181 by Bob Roller
I'm still waiting for an answer to this question.I can't believe that nobody on this forum has the answer.

Bob Roller

Bob Roller

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  • Muzzlehatch
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23 Oct 2013 23:45 #26175 by Muzzlehatch
Replied by Muzzlehatch on topic Road Race
Copies of the book, both hard and soft cover, are available on Amazon and eBay.

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  • Bob McCaffrey
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23 Oct 2013 23:24 #26174 by Bob McCaffrey
Replied by Bob McCaffrey on topic Fond memories and the very basis for my interest
I would strongly advise everyone to take a trip down memory lane, when life was a whole lot simpler. I have re-read the book numerous times since 1959, and have enjoyed it over and over. It was only when I became and active collector that I realized the importance if the book.

bob

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23 Oct 2013 20:22 #26172 by Joel
Replied by Joel on topic Re: Road Race

Muzzlehatch wrote: The first car novel that I ever read was Road Race by Philip Harkins (1952) back in 1960.
It was about a teen named Dave who lives near Branchville, Connecticut, and who wants to join an outlaw hot rod club. The club has as its initiation the requirement that a prospective member challenge the Branchville constable to a night race. The lawman, who is referred to as "Santa Claus" because of his beard, drives an unnamed cruiser that the rodders call a Stupid Six.
As the story progresses, Dave, in his crudely tuned Model A Ford, is ultimately caught by the constable, whose car has been souped up by a mechanic, Webb Walden, who restores and races Duesenbergs. He saves Dave from jail and the loss of his driver's license. As a condition of his suspended sentence, Dave goes to work at Webb's auto repair shop and learns the finer points of race car building and racing.
Harkins credits Jim Hoe and Gayle Smith for the technical help that he received in writing the book, along with Hagen Morris of Westport and W.T. Sperry of Danbury.


I read that book (from our school library) back when I was about 11 years old. I have oft remembered the story, albeit vaguely, but never remembered the title. Now I can look it up and re-read it! Thanks!

Joel Nystrom
1929 Duesenberg Model J Murphy Convertible Coupe
[img

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  • Chris Summers
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22 Oct 2013 20:51 #26158 by Chris Summers
Replied by Chris Summers on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
I actually have a copy of that book, gifted to me by Club member Bob McCaffrey, although I have as yet had time to read it (sorry, Bob!). Probably one of the very few novels to have featured a Duesenberg, outside of Clive Cussler's books.

Chris Summers
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CCCA
H.H. Franklin Club

So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.

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22 Oct 2013 20:41 #26157 by Muzzlehatch
Replied by Muzzlehatch on topic Road Race
The first car novel that I ever read was [i:1xwl4dr4]Road Race[/i:1xwl4dr4] by Philip Harkins (1952) back in 1960.
It was about a teen named Dave who lives near Branchville, Connecticut, and who wants to join an outlaw hot rod club. The club has as its initiation the requirement that a prospective member challenge the Branchville constable to a night race. The lawman, who is referred to as "Santa Claus" because of his beard, drives an unnamed cruiser that the rodders call a Stupid Six.
As the story progresses, Dave, in his crudely tuned Model A Ford, is ultimately caught by the constable, whose car has been souped up by a mechanic, Webb Walden, who restores and races Duesenbergs. He saves Dave from jail and the loss of his driver's license. As a condition of his suspended sentence, Dave goes to work at Webb's auto repair shop and learns the finer points of race car building and racing.
Harkins credits Jim Hoe and Gayle Smith for the technical help that he received in writing the book, along with Hagen Morris of Westport and W.T. Sperry of Danbury.

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07 Aug 2013 08:28 #25687 by landmark
Replied by landmark on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory

silverghost wrote: WOW !

Jim Hoe's old J-183 sure has had many new lives & reincarnations over the decades~~~

It appears that at least many parts of this old car, along with Jim Hoe's old White truck 5 speed transmission conversion, radiator shell, chassis/engine etc. are scattered all over & among a number of other existing Model "J"s.
I was told by Robert that J-183 was once in Dee Howard's ownership !
Perhapps he also got some of Jim Hoe's many other model "J" spares ?

Is it possible his second hillclimb racer (J-number still unknown to me ) was also parted-out & stored by Karl Klieve ?
Could this chassis have been the drilled,lightened & shortened chassis I spoke of earlier ,that Karl is said to have eventually scrapped & dumped ?



Hello,

the car (replica body in Murphy DCP style) with the Bell-housing of J-183 is published by RM Auctions, as sold @St. John's auction for a price of $682000.

www.rmauctions.com/lots/lot.cfm?lot_id=1060306


Cheers

Matt

Was man besonders gerne tut,
ist selten ganz besonders gut

Wilhelm Busch

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  • Bob Roller
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18 Jun 2013 02:17 #25452 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Duesenberg racer
From the pictures I have seen of this car,what Jim lacked in ability to make a body he made up for with enthusiasm.

Bob Roller

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  • RandyEma
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18 Jun 2013 00:08 #25447 by RandyEma
Replied by RandyEma on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Jims car was shortened and lightened via holes . R

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17 Jun 2013 21:07 #25445 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Randy Thank's ! ! !

Perhapps the other second "J" racer that we saw in his "Sportscar Garage" in Westin Ct. was owned by one of his racing customers ?
I found it unique in the fact that it's chassis was drilled, shortened, &amp; lightened .
It was also in very badly battered &amp; butchered shape ~~~much like Jim's J-183 pictured on Jack Curtright's Duesenberg notes website.

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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17 Jun 2013 20:55 #25444 by RandyEma
Replied by RandyEma on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Brad . Jim Hoe was a good friend of mine and I have all his Duesenberg files. I am only aware of one Racer that he built himself and raced which was j183 now a Murphy dual cowl pheaton in Canada and for sale . He did work on other racers though but none that were succesful. R

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17 Jun 2013 18:59 #25441 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
WOW !

Jim Hoe's old J-183 sure has had many new lives &amp; reincarnations over the decades~~~

It appears that at least many parts of this old car, along with Jim Hoe's old White truck 5 speed transmission conversion, radiator shell, chassis/engine etc. are scattered all over &amp; among a number of other existing Model "J"s.
I was told by Robert that J-183 was once in Dee Howard's ownership !
Perhapps he also got some of Jim Hoe's many other model "J" spares ?

Is it possible his second hillclimb racer (J-number still unknown to me ) was also parted-out &amp; stored by Karl Klieve ?
Could this chassis have been the drilled,lightened &amp; shortened chassis I spoke of earlier ,that Karl is said to have eventually scrapped &amp; dumped ?

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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  • landmark
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17 Jun 2013 16:08 #25436 by landmark
Replied by landmark on topic Re: Jim Hoe's hill climbers

Bob Roller wrote: I THINK one of them was J183 and again I THINK it now powers a DCP
perhaps in Canada.If someone knows for sure,I won't get my shirt in a knot if you correct me.

(...)

Bob Roller


Hello Bob,

it looks like you are right! A car called as a Dual-Cowl Phaeton in the style of Murphy, Chassis no. 2201, Bell housing no. J-183 will be auctioned @St. Johns auction by RM www.rmauctions.com/lots/lot.cfm?lot_id=1060306

Matt

Was man besonders gerne tut,
ist selten ganz besonders gut

Wilhelm Busch

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17 Jun 2013 02:38 #25435 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Upgrades to old engines
The 10.5:1 is way too extreme for any antique engine.I think Bill Bocock told be that he bumped his up to about 6.5:1 which is mild and allow the advantages of today's gas.That was J368 I think.
I don't know when the "J" was offered with down draft carburetors but I know J357 built in 1930 had one as did J540-J396-J467 and J528.Whether or not these were change overs from updraft I can't say. There were others we had in the shop but I don't know the #'s.The first one I ever laid a wrench on was J487 and it did have the updraft system.
J542 had a downdraft but when new it had a supercharger which I suppose could be classified as an updraft of sorts.
Speaking of gas,we have a dealer in this area that is selling 90 octane WITHOUT the corn liquor in it (ethanol) at $4.24 a gallon.I didn't ask if it was leaded or not. If it is,I don't want it in my modern fuel injected cars.

Bob Roller

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16 Jun 2013 17:35 #25432 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Sadly I see so many so called "Restorations" done today where the only real restoration attention an old engine actually gets is just a new flashy coat of paint &amp; some polishing of the engine's aluminum &amp; brass !


To many newer present day Classic owners of these fine autos,~~~~who never actually really ever Drive them~~~but instead have them sitting in a museum on static display,
Cosmetics &amp; flashy &amp; sporty coachwork &amp; paint jobs are the most important thing to them.

I would rather own an older "driver" car that runs very well~~~but has some older weathered &amp; chipped paint:.
than a Concours Showcar that only has skin deep beauty~~~and must be trailered on and off the show field because it does not run very well~~if it actually runs at all.


BOB~~~
I actually like the updraft carburators~~~especially if that is what was on the engine when the car was originally built when new.
I like 100% originality !
They do have their limitations as you suggested however~~~

When in the production engine number range of the Model "J" was the switch made to the downdraft style carb ? ? ?

Upgrading the connecting rods &amp; adding modern style rod &amp; main bearings are great ideas~~~
From the exterior of the engine you cannot tell they were upgraded~~~But the engine will live much longer with them installed.

New Higher Compression pistons are OK ~~~to a point.

But I saw a friend destroy a 1914 Silver-Ghost engine because he added new 9.5:1 pistons on a rebuild~~~and pushed her way too far climbing a hill while on tour trying to show-off her new-found power &amp; speed to his old Silver Ghost friends.
A old original rod let loose and punched right through the side of the aluminum crankcase; &amp; also destroyed one of the iron engine blocks.

What a tragic &amp; costly mistake that was ! ! !

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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16 Jun 2013 17:01 #25431 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Drive them if you have them
If a fine car like a Duesenberg can't be driven and enjoyed without becoming a real pain in the backside,then it needs another owner or a major engine rebuild with modern upgrades like better bearings throughout,"I"beam rods,reground and rehardened crankshaft and a slight bump up in compression ratio.
I watched those guys trying to get J219 running and when it started it was rough,blowing black smoke and back firing.I wonder if anyone bothered to check valve clearences or run a compression check. Another video showed the Don Kerr speedster and it sounded like the pistons were changing holes and more black smoke. That updraft carburetor doesn't help anything either. I was surprised when I saw how many of them still
have that relic hanging from the intake manifold. I am think too much is spent on cosmetics and little on the engine even if it is an embarrasment to the owner.

Bob Roller

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15 Jun 2013 21:40 #25429 by landmark
Replied by landmark on topic Re: $100 bills and other things

silverghost wrote:
(...)

I say they should be able to be actually Driven & Toured long distances without any fear of catastrophic mechanical engine failures.
That's what they were originally built for by Fred Duesenberg, & old E L Cord, in the first place.

Don't kill me here guys~~~
It's just my opinion~~~
But in your heart you know I might just be correct in my mechanical evaluation of SOME, but not All, of these great Model "J' autos !



Hello,

and by the way, here is a "nice" video about some "specialists"
:rolleyes: trying hard to start J-219? @retromobile 2013 auction

Sounds more like a shotgun than a proper adjusted 8 inline <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: -->




Have a nice weekend!

Matt

Was man besonders gerne tut,
ist selten ganz besonders gut

Wilhelm Busch

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15 Jun 2013 15:29 #25428 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Worn ot engines
I would think that any full restoration would include a complete rebuild and maybe upgrades on the engine. I suppose there are a number of barely running trailer queens and that is sad but if the car isn't going to be driven then the expense isn't wanted.

Bob Roller

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15 Jun 2013 14:27 #25427 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic Re: $100 bills and other things

Bob Roller wrote: Going to another letter,it was stated that Jim Hoe did a lot of work on Springfield Rolls-Royce cars.That reminds me of an incident when we were
redoing J528 in the early 1950's. The director of the Huntington Symphony Orchestra had a beautiful 1930 RR Conv.coupe and he stopped in to see what we were doing with the Duesenberg. I was just finishing the valve lapping and he asked me what I was doing and I told him.He said he'd never have to do that to the Rolls and my reply was that it couldn't run fast enough to wear out. He failed to see the humor in that and left.

Bob Roller


Bob~~~

While what you say may be very true~~~

The Rolls~Royce Silver Ghosts & Phantoms were never Ever intended to be high speed performance cars~~~
They were very high quality over engineered & overbuilt mechanical designs that were built with precision like a fine Swiss watch.
Internally the engines were low-speed reving, understressed & overbuilt designs originally designed to basically last a car owner's entire lifetime without any major internal engine or drive line breakdowns !

Most of the Springfield R~R cars that are heavily toured all over the world today have Never Ever had their engines opened-up & totally taken apart~~~and they still run as quiet & powerful, with monster torque like a steam engine, as when built brand new !

How many Model "J" Duesenbergs do you know of today that can make this very same claim ?

We both know that Many model "J" auto engines today are just plain worn-out and in dire need of a total proper engine rebuild~~~ and one would Never consider Ever taking them on a tour withot a 100% total complete engine rebuild !

We all know of some cosmetically fantastinc looking & very sporty Model "J" Duesenbergs that are just fine as static museum pieces, or Concours show trailer queens !

I not very long ago saw a super looking model "J" cross the Auction block and sell in the Million $$$ range.
After the hammer came down two fellows standing nearby who really knew All about this very car made the comment~~~
" WOW ! ! ! What a great price for a car that basically has an engine that is totally shot & worn-out ! "

It seems many Model "J" Duesenberg autos have really been only cosmetically restored over & over again multiple times over the decades to suit the various owner's color & coachwork style tastes ~~~ but have never Ever had a proper mechanical internal engine rebuild !

Sadly many of these fine cars are only used as investments, and museum static display-only Concours event trailer queen artworks, for their owners who flip them for another model "J" every few years in order to be invited again to attend the same Concours event next year with another different model "J" Duesenberg car !


I say they should be able to be actually Driven & Toured long distances without any fear of catastrophic mechanical engine failures.
That's what they were originally built for by Fred Duesenberg, & old E L Cord, in the first place.

Don't kill me here guys~~~
It's just my opinion~~~
But in your heart you know I might just be correct in my mechanical evaluation of SOME, but not All, of these great Model "J' autos !

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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15 Jun 2013 11:07 #25426 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic $100 bills and other things
Mike,
The value of the $100 bill in 1952 was a LOT higher than today's funny money. I recently laid out $96 for meals at a local eatery and it didn't put any strain on the bank account. When I bought that Packard,I had a "choice" between it and Ford Model "A". Those old Fords to me were cars that started at the bottom and went down from there.
Going to another letter,it was stated that Jim Hoe did a lot of work on Springfield Rolls-Royce cars.That reminds me of an incident when we were
redoing J528 in the early 1950's. The director of the Huntington Symphony Orchestra had a beautiful 1930 RR Conv.coupe and he stopped in to see what we were doing with the Duesenberg. I was just finishing the valve lapping and he asked me what I was doing and I told him.He said he'd never have to do that to the Rolls and my reply was that it couldn't run fast enough to wear out. He failed to see the humor in that and left.

Bob Roller

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15 Jun 2013 03:18 #25423 by mikespeed35
Replied by mikespeed35 on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Hi Bob, Was that $100. bill also bigger than a bed sheet?
CORDially Mike

Mike Huffman

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14 Jun 2013 23:36 #25422 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Left over engines
I see J552 listed as a never installed engine but it seems to me that it
powers a Rollston CC a LWB one.

Bob Roller

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14 Jun 2013 19:47 #25421 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic Re: Jim Hoe's hill climbers

Bob Roller wrote: I THINK one of them was J183 and again I THINK it now powers a DCP
perhaps in Canada.If someone knows for sure,I won't get my shirt in a knot if you correct me. Jim told me I could buy one of them for $1600 many years ago... ~~~

Bob Roller


BOB Thank's !

That's one of Jim's hillclimb racers that I remember seeing in the 50s-60s ~~~The one with the cycle fenders.

Here is a link to period photos below on Jack Curtrght's great website~~~

duesey186.com/Datasheets/Model_J ... rm2201.htm

Jim also had a second Model "J" racecar/"sportscar" at this same time period that appeared to be in a much more battered & butchered chopped-up condition~~~
if you can believe that is indeed at all possible ?

The second racecar had large hole-saw holes cut all over it's entire chassis in an effort to lighten the chassis up for racing.

Does anyone know this second Model "J" engine & chassis/body numbers ?

As I said before~~~
Jim Hoe drove the living daylights, & beat the guts, out of his Duesenberg "Sportscars" !

The picture linked above proves my point perfectly !
No Concours Pebble Beach Showcars for hillclimb racer Jim Hoe !

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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14 Jun 2013 18:35 #25419 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Jim Hoe's hill climbers
I THINK one of them was J183 and again I THINK it now powers a DCP
perhaps in Canada.If someone knows for sure,I won't get my shirt in a knot if you correct me. Jim told me I could buy one of them for $1600 many years ago but when you live in an area in Appalachia where possesion of a $100 bill was proof of felonious behavior,I had no way to buy it.The BEST I did back in that 1952 era was to scrape up $150 to buy a 1935 Packard Super Eight convt.with wire wheels and rumble seat and a NEW top.

Bob Roller

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14 Jun 2013 17:55 #25416 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic A. James Hoe's Hill Climb Duesenbergs ?
When Dad, &amp; I as a little kid in the late 50s-early 60s first met Jim Hoe , at his small Weston Ct. "Sports Car Garage" he owned two stripped-down model "J" Hill Climb race Duesenbergs that he used to race from time to time.

To Jim the giant Duesenberg Model "J"s were the "Sportscars " he actually specialized in !

They were in a heavily battered, butchered, &amp; chopped body condition as I remember~~~

Jim really beat the living daylights out of these cars.
He would often appear at a fairly local hill climb event Giant's Despair Hillclimb in Penna. from time to time ~~~and I actually saw him race during at least two of these hill-climb events~~but I was very young at this time to have remembered very much of these hillclimb race events.

The Model "j"s did not have the crazy high values at this time period~~~as they do today.
And Jim was really "only into" their engineering &amp; mechanical performance~~~ and really did not care one bit what they actually looked like cosmetically according to my Dad!

My questions to the ACD forum members~~~

What ever happened to Jim Hoe's two hill-climb Duesenberg model "J" s ?

Were they ever restored &amp; rebodied ; or in fact ever saved from his Duesenberg parts stockpiled scrap pile ?

What were their "J" engine &amp; body numbers ?

Are there any surviving old photos of Jim's Model "J" autos actually in hillclimb racing condition ?

Rolls~Royce Springfield Ghosts &amp; Phantoms &amp; Jim Hoe:

Many here may not know that Arthur James Hoe was also heavily involved in the repair of Springfield Rolls~Royce autos at this same time period.

Springfield owners would seek him out for expert engine &amp; mechanical repairs; and original parts along with his friend , and fellow Springfield R~R expert Frank Cooke .

In Fact~~~
Jim probably actually repaired more Springfield R~R autos at this time period than model "J" Duesenbergs~~~

After all ~~~there were many more of these Springfield R~R cars on the east coast at this time period than Duesenberg model "J's !

In fact~~~That's why we first visited his "Sportscar Garage".
Dad had removed an early Springfield Phantom I "ironhead" cylinder head from one of his cars and had Jim install new pressed-in valve guides, felt stye valve stem seals ; and also do a "valve grind &amp; finish valve lapping job" on this monster size 1927 iron OHV cylinder head.

Jim, as I remember him, was a very nice guy !
He gave me several Tootsie Roll Pops that he kept on hand in a large sealed jar for his customer's kids !
It seemed Jim loved them too !

I believe he also, at this time, taught at a local High School, or Night School, in his area ?

Does anyone else here remember ever meeting Jim Hoe ? ? ?

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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18 Dec 2010 13:54 #18827 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Mix up on the Deutschevolk
I win the bonehead award for the moment at least.I got the Germans mixed up on the Bauer car. Rudy Creteur was the man at Rollson and NOT Gus Reuter.
I think Gus Reuter also had a good reputation for doing fine upholstery on high dollar cars..There is a man across the street from me that can do high class interiors on cars IF he can be talked into it.

Bob Roller

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17 Dec 2010 14:29 #18818 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Gus Reuter
First,a short German lesson.Reuter in German is pronounced ROYter,not ROOTER.
Wasn't he the man who did the body making or at least the supervising of it on J397.the Rudolph Bauer car? Seems to me I saw some reprints of drawings,actually sketches of that car with all sorts of German scribbling around them.I don't know iof the scribbling was his or Bauer's. He must have worked for Rollston,later on reorganized as Rollson. I heard they are still doing sheet metal work and made or are still making galley equipment for the Navy.One thing is certain,the body work Rollston did was fine.

Bob Roller

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  • balinwire
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16 Dec 2010 19:35 #18807 by balinwire
Replied by balinwire on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Gus Reuter's comment, "And anyway I don't have the collectors' mentality", reminds me of another mechanics comment, "We dont own them, they are for rich people". Sometimes it occurs to me which stable I belong.
Tom Waits said, "Jim Jarmuch once told me Fast, Cheap, and Good...pick two. If it's fast and cheap it wont be good. If it's cheap and good it won't be fast. If it's fast and good it won't be cheap. Fast, cheap and good...pick (2) words to live by.

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16 Dec 2010 03:42 #18799 by Chris Summers
Replied by Chris Summers on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Ken Purdy wrote an article on Reuter, "The Body Beautiful," for the September 1970 issue of "Holiday" magazine. The article was reprinted in the 1972 "Ken Purdy's Book of Automobiles." It is wonderful reading on the oldest of old-school restoration.

[i:3tkbpxu5]Reuter drives a Ford. "I've ever been able to afford a car I restored," he says. "And anyway I don't have the collectors' mentality. Collectors are strange people."[/i:3tkbpxu5]

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16 Dec 2010 03:08 #18798 by Josh Malks
Replied by Josh Malks on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
A funny old Cord + Duesenberg story:

As I have stated often enough, when I first started driving Cords I lived in The Bronx in New York City. One crisp winter day I was driving my Cord north toward Mount Vernon to visit with Sam Adelman. My favorite route took me up the Boston Post Road, so named because in revolutionary times it was the stagecoach route between New York and Boston.

A few weeks earlier I had acquired a small dent in the left rear fender, no bigger than a teacup. Not far from The Bronx city limits I spied an auto body shop on the left side of the road. The simple sign above the door said ?Reuter's?. Well, said I to myself, here's a chance to get an estimate of what fixing that little dent will cost.

When I drove into the shop an older man was working on a big old car. (Of course I was 18 years old at the time, so [i:uwmnz53p]everyone[/i:uwmnz53p] was an older man.) I inquired about an estimate. The man barely looked up. "Son, he said, "I would have to charge you more to fix that dent than you paid for that Cord.? And with that Gus Reuter went back to sanding on J-481/2503, Greta Garbo's Fernandez and Darrin convertible victoria.

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16 Dec 2010 02:08 #18796 by Chris Summers
Replied by Chris Summers on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Hoe was responsible for the original restoration of J-585 / 2614, at least mechanically - the cosmetic work was done by Gus Reuter, another great early name in the restoration business. The car is right-hand-drive.

I checked on the original photo at the Detroit library and there was nothing identifying it.

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16 Dec 2010 02:03 #18795 by Steve Derus
Replied by Steve Derus on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
good catch there Bob, I would think that settles it as the G/N car?

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16 Dec 2010 01:59 #18794 by Bob Roller
Replied by Bob Roller on topic Maharajah car
Whatever it is,I don't see the steering column coming thru on the left side of the firewall.

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15 Dec 2010 20:41 #18792 by Steve Derus
Replied by Steve Derus on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
I think if you look at this image it will clear up any doubt. The hood doesn't go quite all the way to the windshield and the Jim Hoe photo seems to match up.

www.ultimatecarpage.com/pic/3444 ... ter_4.html

Steve

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15 Dec 2010 19:36 #18789 by
The windshield looks like GN, but what about the hood?
The hood of GN Convertible Coupe doesn?t end at the firewall.
Or is this a former look of it?

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13 Dec 2010 16:43 #18758 by Chris Summers
Replied by Chris Summers on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
It had several owners in NY State during that period.

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13 Dec 2010 15:31 #18756 by alsancle
Replied by alsancle on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
The GN SJ was in the New England area in the late 50s - early 60s - correct? I have a nice picture of my dad taking best of show against it with his Auburn coupe in Sturbridge Mass. I understand the owner was not too thrilled with htat.

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12 Dec 2010 19:18 #18749 by Chris Summers
Replied by Chris Summers on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
I first thought it was an SSJ until I remembered they have one-piece windshields. Upon closer examination I agree with you, judging by the unusual shape of the windshield frame.

That would place this picture in the early to mid 1960s.

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12 Dec 2010 18:59 #18748 by Steve Derus
Replied by Steve Derus on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Chris,

I'm thinking the car is 2614/J585 the Gurney/Nutting Maharajah car?

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12 Dec 2010 10:04 #18746 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Chris :
Great photo~~~
Thank's for posting it here !
This sure brings back an early memory of long long ago !

I think many modern Duesenberg collectors today have no real idea how important the few early collectors, &amp; restorers were in saving these fantastic autos, &amp; spare parts, from the scrap yards.
If not for Jim Hoe, and a few others with foresight most of these great autos would be long lost to future generations.
Most folks at the time thought that they were almost worthless~~~Just old worthless auto scrap.
These very early Duesenberg lovers saw their real true historical, and technical value~~~

To them, like all of us here today, these great autos are almost priceless !

My Father who just passed-away at 92 would have loved to have seen that old B&amp;W photo of his old friend Jim Hoe !

Thank's for helping bring back a memory of many trips to Jim Hoe's Sports Car Garage with my Father so long long ago !

I only wish I had a time machine to make just one more trip like that with my Father.
l really miss you Dad !

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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12 Dec 2010 05:46 #18745 by Chris Summers
Replied by Chris Summers on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
I forgot I had this picture. It is a scan of an original in the National Automotive History Collection of the Detroit Public Library.

Just another day at the office in Weston, CT, c. late 1950s.


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18 Nov 2010 05:15 #18458 by Justin Kerns
Replied by Justin Kerns on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
Just want to clarify and inform everyone that the Newsletter DVD can now be purchased directly from the club estore by looking here: shop.phpstack-1081784-3880776.cloudwaysapps.com/

In agreement with the other comments - I can't say enough to recommend this invaluable resource!

Everyone should look at the estore if you haven't lately. It has been updated recently and there is more to come!

Justin

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17 Nov 2010 21:10 #18450 by oldbanger71
Replied by oldbanger71 on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
I would think that even you as a non-member can buy tha ACD-archiev-DVD.
Contact :
<a href="mailto:[email protected]][email protected][/url]

Robert Coleman

But let you be told; you will never experience more support, clubman-ship and knowledge for so little money in any other car club !
The DVD was made to not loose the knowledge from the past 57 years but knowledge is not stopping there, it lives on up to today's technics sources
and last but not least inovative clubmembers, who develop replacement parts for those you can't buy anymore or those that often fail ..... do i need to say more ? This club offers me all this for a fraction that a Rolls Royce club, or similar, asks without this support for the same money. <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: -->

The more i know, the more i realize that i don't know enough.
812 310 121 S

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17 Nov 2010 20:12 #18447 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic Not an ACD Club Member
JOSH:
I just joined your great foum a very short time ago and am not an ACD club member~
As a result I do not have access to the archive DVD !

BRAD

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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17 Nov 2010 16:35 #18441 by Josh Malks
Replied by Josh Malks on topic Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory
In your ACD Club Archive DVD, using "Search all issues", enter "Gebby" and "Hoe". Lots to see there.

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17 Nov 2010 05:15 #18433 by silverghost
Replied by silverghost on topic Hill Climb &quot;J&quot;s
If you google-search for Arthur James Hoe Duesenberg Hill climb you will find several Sports Car websites that list Jim Hoe , along with long-time early Duesenberg racer/owner Jerry Gebby listed !
There you will see their various race and hill-climb results along with the locations of the race events in the 1950s-1960s ~

Arthur James Hoe~ Better known as~
Jim Hoe raced &amp; hill-climbed both a model"J" &amp; and an "SJ"
Jerry E. Gebby raced and hill-Climbed an" SJ"

There were at least three other fellows who also activly raced Model "J" Duesenbergs in this time period in the 1950s.

I believe that Shappy's model "J" that surfaced unrestored a few short years back was once raced
for a brief time also by Phil Cade !
Then it just sat~
Waiting to be re-discovered !

Where are these great former 1950s race and hill-climb cars today &amp; what condition are they now in today ?

As I mentioned before Jim Hoe , Gebby, Cade, and several other "Sports Car Club of America" boys beat the living daylights out of these model "J" Dueseys !
After all~ Nobody seemed to want them ; and they were almost worthless in the 1950s !

Boy oh Boy~ have times and the car's values changed !

Dad knew most of these Duesenberg racers.
Sadly~
I only knew Jim Hoe !

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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15 Nov 2010 06:39 #18395 by silverghost
Jim Hoe Sportscar Garage 1950s Memory was created by silverghost
Hello: I am a new ACD forum member here!
My 92 y/o father was an early Classic &amp; Brass_Era Car collector &amp; I have been around the great Classics all my life~
I am now 55 y/o !

My father was great friends with Henry Austin "Austie" Clarke an early antique mega-car collector and we would often visit
his great Long Island NY car museum !

Through Dad's friendship with "Austie" we had the pleasure of meeting Jim Hoe who at this time ran his "Sportcar Garage" In Weston Ct.Jim was a super guy !
We visited his great "garage" many times !

Jim liked to drive and race his "sportscars"
He especially liked Hill-Climb events !
When he got tired of the smaller sportscars jim got into racing Duesenberg Model "J" autos.
Jim also called these cars his "Sportscars " !
He got involved with the great model "J" at a fairly young age !

A typical visit to his garage would find all manner of Duesenberg cars as well as engines and tons of model "J" parts all over his shop!

Jim is often called one of the very first Duesenberg model "J" restorers ~
But in reality, at least in my early memory, Jim was really a racer / driver/ engine rebuilder.
Jim did not baby these cars like most Duesenberg owners do today~

He really drove them !
Jim always told Dad &amp; I that they were built to be driven~
And drive them he did !

In fact he, and some of his friends, really beat the living daylights out of these great model"J" s !
You have to remember these cars were almost worthless in the early 1950s after the war !
Most folks thought it crazy to be interested in these old relics !

Jim had a favorite hill-climb chassis that he had dug-up and often raced. It had a crude home-built racing body.
He had hacked-up and shortened it's chassis.
To lighten this chassis he used a hole saw to cut holes everywhere ! he chassis looked like swiss cheese !
He and his Duesenberg "Sportscar" friends blew-up many a model "J' engine.
Some were sitting all around his garage.
Connecting rods, one of the model "J" engine's weak links would often be thrown through the crankcase, pan, or blocks .

Dad often speculated that the reason many Duesenberg model "J" cars today often have so many mixed engine, bellhousing, and chassis numbers was because of jim and his racing &amp; hill-climb friends.
They mixed and matched parts to keep these great cars running !
We know of no other big full Classics that are so mixed &amp; matched engine &amp; chassis wise.
They early-on seemed to have no respect at all for great original coachwork !
Great body &amp; Coahwork did not interest them at this point in time !
Word soon spread nationwide about Jim's Duesenbeg garage &amp; shop.
Owners and early collectors would often seek-out jim for help with repairs, and much needed rare spares.
Jim would reproduce or supply much needed early repair parts.
Everyone knows of his adaptation of the early White truck transmission for the model "J" . He thought this truck gearbox much more robust than the Warner High Flex T-72 unit.
JIm found this gearbox especially usefull for hill-climb events, after wrecking many stock Duesenberg Warner units.
We both saw Jim Hoe and others at several hill-climb events here in Pa.
Jim knew all the weak points of the model "J"s chassis and running gear.

Jim Hoe's interest in racing &amp; hill-climb events soon declined around about the same time as the early Classic car collectors
started paying attention to the great Classics. Prices for Duesenberg, Rolls~Royce, Hispanos, Isottas, and similar cars started to climb rapidly.
Classic Car collecting had arrived !

Jim Hoe and his "Sportscar Garage" then soon started to actually do some of the first real restorations on these once grand and now neglected and sometimes abused Classics.
JIm supplied many of the first early restoration parts.
He was great friends of Sam Edelman who had a great Classics only junkyard in New York.
Sam was quite a guy also.
We have many great stories of both Sam an Jim as well as "Austie" Clarke
Dad was friends with them all !
Many great cars went through his "Sportscar Garage " over the years .
Jim Hoe truely loved these fantastic cars.
He really respected Fred Duesenberg and his racing and engineering design skills.

Jim Hoe and his friends &amp; customers saved many a great Classic; and many a Model "J" Duesenberg !

But it is often forgotten that Jim Hoe loved to race and actually drive these great performance "Sportscars" more than anything !.
They were not museum objects or show car trailer queens to Jim~
They were built to be driven~
And drive them he did with a great passion !

I will never ever forget our many trips to Jim Hoe's "Sportscar Garage" in Ct in the 1950s and 1960s !
Jim Hoe was a great car guy !

Jim Hoe was in reality "Mr. Duesenberg" in the 50s &amp; 60s !

BRAD HUNTER

This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. BRAD HUNTER Huntingdon Valley Pa/Ocean City NJ 215 947 4676 Engineer & RE Developer Brass & Classic Auto, Antique Boat, Mechanical Automatic Music Machine, & Jukebox Collector

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